Where is the "proverbial line" drawn between "Key" and "Semi-key"

dizzyfoxx

Depending on issue of course, is it an obvious differentiation or is it often somewhat subjective?

crypto79

Demand! Keys sell quickly & simi-keys sell simi-quickly

doh

I think it's very subjective. Some people would pick mintage, others pricepoint, others difficulty in a certain grade...

garrynot

And with the emphasis on varieties in many series, particularly silver dollars, the term "Key" means something different to different collectors.

crypto79

Key= the hole least often filled in the witman folder that comes into the coin dealer B&M

Simi-key = The coin most offten in really bad shape in the witman folder that comes into the coin dealer B&M

roadrunner

In my experiences the semi-keys in the seated series sell very quickly while the much more expensive (and not much rarer) "keys" sell more slowly. It comes down to absolute price vs. relative rarity.

Key vs. semi-key depends on what series and what grades you are talking about. To me, semi-key often means "underrated" and "underpriced." It's not always the case though. 70-cc quarters and 78-s halves are certainly key dates, but neither is underrated imo nor underpriced compared to the rest of the series. I can think of about 50 seated coins I would want to own first before one of those two....just my 2 cents. Often related to "key" date are the terms manipulated, overpriced, expensive, low mintage (regardless of actual survival rate), popular, etc. The 09-s vdb is certainly a key date in that series, but there are probably a lot of VF/XF mint-marked semi-keys from 1910-1930 that are much better values and keys in their own right.

A lot of what makes key dates "key" is folklore, legend, and experiences from many decades past. And some of the old lore is now impossible to eradicate. They may not actually be key dates at all with all the new information available to current collectors.

The line that I draw between keys and semi-keys is basically I love to buy semi-keys but rarely splurge for keys.

roadrunner

crypto79

<< <i>In my experiences the semi-keys in the seated series sell very quickly while the much more expensive (and not much rarer) "keys" sell more slowly. It comes down to absolute price vs. relative rarity.

Key vs. semi-key depends on what series and what grades you are talking about. To me, semi-key often means "underrated" and "underpriced." It's not always the case though. 70-cc quarters and 78-s halves are certainly key dates, but neither is underrated imo nor underpriced compared to the rest of the series. I can think of about 50 seated coins I would want to own first before one of those two....just my 2 cents. Often related to "key" date are the terms manipulated, overpriced, expensive, low mintage (regardless of actual survival rate), popular, etc. The 09-s vdb is certainly a key date in that series, but there are probably a lot of VF/XF mint-marked semi-keys from 1910-1930 that are much better values and keys in their own right.

A lot of what makes key dates "key" is folklore, legend, and experiences from many decades past. And some of the old lore is now impossible to eradicate. They may not actually be key dates at all with all the new information available to current collectors.

The line that I draw between keys and semi-keys is basically I love to buy semi-keys but rarely splurge for keys.
roadrunner >>



What he said is all true. I would point out that if you used price as a control and priced them the same the key would sell 99% of the time first proving its based off of demand. How it got its key status be it Redbook fame or Annie Dime stories is on a case by case bases.

renman95

It's subjective depending on the series. In the classic series mintage plays a part. In moderns it difficult to determine when a supposed semi key has 100's millions compared to a key with 10's of millions.

fc

if you look at the lib half eagle series it is totally full of semi keys but
no one seems to care. think the 1870s for example.

and the true keys, only a uber wealthy collector can buy them. think
1854S and 1875P.

so in the end for this series... it becomes pointless for me to think
about. Some of the more common examples are considered keys
even though they may be 2-5 times more common then then the
true semi keys. perception is everything it seems.

StubbyMcNumbthumbs

I've always looked at it as the key being "historically, the hardest date to acquire, whether that be due to the cost or the lack of available examples."

Semi-keys are the other "harder than normal to find" coins of that particular series. Anything that sets them above the "common date" tag.

In any particular series, there is only one key, and usually a few semi-keys.


That's the way I see it.
Your mileage may vary.

SCDHunter

Its a semi-key when buying and a key when selling.

dogwood

Much to agree with here.
I would add a key date is that date most unlikely to be pulled from circulation for the set collectors of yore. The 32-s and 32-d Quarters, the 16-d Dime, etc. So that one would need to allot funds above face value to obtain.
A semi-key was probably a following development used by the coin dealers to sell coins in their advertisements to impart them with a certain stature.

DieClash

I've found that the decimal point between keys and semi-keys is one to two notches higher.

Frankcoins

You just feel it...

Overdate

Some sets don't have any keys at all, aside from varieties or condition rarities.

Circulated Franklin halves and silver Roosevelt dimes are examples.

GoldenEyeNumismatics

Whether you're buying or selling. LOL

Baley

of what practical use is defining "the line"? serious question.

people always ask, what's the line between classic and modern? what's the line between AT and NT?

and now what's the line between key and semi-key?

serious question: why does it matter? if one understands the concept of a continuum and can apply common sense, why does one need a line?

RYK

I am with Baley on this. Gun to my head, the "key date" is the single (or up to three, in some cases), most difficult or most expensive coin in the series. For merc dimes, it's the 16-D. For standing quarters, the 16. It's the one with the cardboard circle in the Whitman folder.

For some series, there really is no key date. Take coronet $5's (fc's example). There are multiple relatively difficult, rare, and/or expensive issues. For Lincoln memorial cents, there are no difficult, rare, or expensive dates. What's the "key date" of $20 Libs?

"Semi-key" is an expression that I have only heard in the last several years. In most cases, it is used by a seller to promote an issue which is marginally more difficult or expensive than the common/type.

Frankly, I never personally use either term and rarely see them used, other than on this forum.

barbershopper

<< <i>I think it's very subjective. Some people would pick mintage, others pricepoint, others difficulty in a certain grade... >>



That was going to be my answer. Also, I think too many dealers use the semi-key terminology.

JT

ElKevvo

It's the one with the cardboard circle in the Whitman folder.

That was true for me when I was a kid and it still is true but 'It is the one you can see all the way through in the Dansco".

K

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