"Bear market" reports at Long Beach may be premature

Halfsense

It is 12:30 Saturday afternoon at the Long Beach Expo, and there are many "collectors" in attendance today. These are the rank and file, day-in/day-out collectors who are filling holes in albums, building collections of raw or certified coins and bank notes. There also are a number of families. You'll find them generally toward the back of the room where the small to mid-size dealers have tables.

While the "Top Tier/Finest Known/My Gawd, I've Never Seen One Slabbed That High" Market may or may not be taking a breather depending on who you talk to -- and when you talk to them -- it's obvious there still are active buyers among "collectors" who are apparently not affected by significant drops in the price of gold, the sale of Ohio coins or Buffalo bullion pieces stampeding dollars away from some dealers. We've had a two-tiered market for many years, and that is easily seen today. Sometimes, we mistakenly overlook that, concentrating only on how the "serious collectors" and dealers are doing at that second. I'm confident about the top tier market; it perhaps just needs a brief break. The other tier appears to moving right along.

Seen on the bourse floor late Friday afternoon: the coin-collecting Mayor of Oakland, California, Jerry Brown. The former California Governor who now is running for State Attorney General, made a campaign stop and also spent nearly a half hour looking at items in display cases.

-donn-

Michigan

<< <i>It is 12:30 Saturday afternoon at the Long Beach Expo, and there are many "collectors" in attendance today. These are the rank and file, day-in/day-out collectors who are filling holes in albums, building collections of raw or certified coins and bank notes. There also are a number of families. You'll find them generally toward the back of the room where the small to mid-size dealers have tables.

While the "Top Tier/Finest Known/My Gawd, I've Never Seen One Slabbed That High" Market may or may not be taking a breather depending on who you talk to -- and when you talk to them -- it's obvious there still are active buyers among "collectors" who are apparently not affected by significant drops in the price of gold, the sale of Ohio coins or Buffalo bullion pieces stampeding dollars away from some dealers. We've had a two-tiered market for many years, and that is easily seen today. Sometimes, we mistakenly overlook that, concentrating only on how the "serious collectors" and dealers are doing at that second. I'm confident about the top tier market; it perhaps just needs a brief break. The other tier appears to moving right along.

Seen on the bourse floor late Friday afternoon: the coin-collecting Mayor of Oakland, California, Jerry Brown. The former California Governor who now is running for State Attorney General, made a campaign stop and also spent nearly a half hour looking at items in display cases.

-donn- >>




The "little" people don't matter to the "market makers" don't you know?

291fifth

The "little" people don't matter to the "market makers" don't you know? >>



While probably written in jest, this statement is likely accurate.

SanctionII

I wonder what ex Governor "Moonbeam" Jerry Brown collects and wonder how tough on crime he would be if he wins the coming election for Attorney General if some punk thief broke into his residence and stole his coin collection.

Maybe he would not be troubled by it since the thief was probably justified in his actions due to his being oppressed by society and due to Jerry Brown being unfairly placed in the upper strata of society due to his parents position and his birth into the Brown family.

On second thought, probably he would throw the book at the thief, just as I would expect any similarly situated "liberal elite" to be out for blood if someone stole their stuff.

zenny

<< <i>On second thought, probably he would throw the book at the thief, just as I would expect any similarly situated "liberal elite" to be out for blood if someone stole their stuff. >>




Smoeone misses the of................

RVDavis

<< <i>I wonder what ex Governor "Moonbeam" Jerry Brown collects and wonder how tough on crime he would be if he wins the coming election for Attorney General if some punk thief broke into his residence and stole his coin collection.

Maybe he would not be troubled by it since the thief was probably justified in his actions due to his being oppressed by society and due to Jerry Brown being unfairly placed in the upper strata of society due to his parents position and his birth into the Brown family.

On second thought, probably he would throw the book at the thief, just as I would expect any similarly situated "liberal elite" to be out for blood if someone stole their stuff. >>



I read the bear reports this morning, then went to two of my regular coin dealers. They were both as busy as I have seen in a few years, I had to wait almost half an hour to crusie the Morgans for VAMs. So, I agree that everyday collectors are still out there in force. Also, VAM prices continue to do very well.

Off topic (sort of) in reference to the above quote: I am myself very liberal, although not elite. For this liberal, having been the victim of crime twice, I believe in law enforcement. I imagine liberal elite folks believe in the same. Being liberal on social issues does not, in any way, mean it is OK not to adhere to the rules and standards of acceptable social behavior. Like not stealing my coins. That's my view.

By the way, what makes a person a member of the liberal 'elite' is that sort of like mensa? Do you have to take a test and then you get a membership card, or does my ACLU card suffice?

Back on topic: Thanks for a great Long Beach report.

Rick

jdimmick

I did not realize how many of the larger dealers look down on or ignore the average collector until I starting assisting a dealer friend at the larger national shows a few years ago. I herd statements like "tire kickers, "bunch of nobody's, or budget minders, etc. Many of the them dont even consider these folks as part of thier show business as being a success or not?? It was quite disturbing too me when I was first subjected to it, but then learn to accept it. I feel that numismatics was one hobby that could be enjoyed by a person regardless of thier finacial means, and be treated with the same courtesy and respect, but it isnt that way on the big business bourse.

Tarmac

I did not realize how many of the larger dealers look down on or ignore the average collector

Or the ones who judge people on appearance.

I can assure you from personal experiences the vast majority of these dealers are poor business people. Their arrogance is only surpassed by their ignorance.

When I first started collecting I received such frosty treatment from some of the nation's major dealers I decided to go directly to auctions and other collectors for my coins. I learned a lot from fellow collectors. Along the way I met lots of great guys and managed to trade, buy and sell over the years well into the 7 figures. My collection never got more than about $150k and most of that was from trading up and starting with about $25k. It can be done.

My point is these dealers missed out on over a millions dollars of sales from a scuffy, long haired, bit overweight, eye glass wearing 'nobody' over a 22 years period. Sure I am going to kick the tires when I buy a coin costing more than the dealer's car. While the dealer had to probably check with his wife before he bought the car I only had to check the rims/surfaces before I bought that five figure coin.

Finally, I've met a guy who run auto body shop and has dirty fingernails, another guy who raise Arabian horses [and smell like them sometimes], and one who is his own handyman so he can do his own repairs on his almost 200 units of rentals. Every single one ofthese guys is salt of the earth and no one would ever imagine they have collections exceeding a million bucks, much of it purchased/inherited before I was born.

You never know in coins.