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If You Were Selling a Half Million Dollar Collection, Where Would You Consign?
markglicker
Posts: 1,486
Of the large coin auctioneers, where have you had the best results. What type of commission should one expect to pay?
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Russ, NCNE
New collectors, please educate yourself before spending money on coins; there are people who believe that using numismatic knowledge to rip the naïve is what this hobby is all about.
Tom
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
Specializing in 1854 and 1855 large FE patterns
<
Oh, and having QDB sort of overseeing things wouldn't hurt either!
Jeremy
Personally I could NEVER consign or sell my coins because anything like that would imply I (or we) are not true collectors. And heaven forbid if anyone should insinuate such a thing. But if I had to because of duress or kidnapping, I would go with Heritage or ANR, at either spring or fall Long Beach or FUN or summer ANA.
roadrunner
J
siliconvalleycoins.com
GTS
ditto
rainbowroosie April 1, 2003
I'd try to negotiate the best rate possible and compare what the various firms offer.
For $500K+ consignment, I would think ~102%+ of the hammer price should be possible, but it depends on what is in your $500K collection.
<< <i>$500k at 102%???? Come on now - negotiate a little harder!
My original post pre-edit had a higher % in it, then I thought I'd better to be conservative and not get anybody's hopes up. If the $500K is in unsearched wheat pennies (pardon the hyperbole) it may not be a very succesful negotiation over on West 57th.
In my will which is going to be revised, I recommended that my estate auction my coins with David Bowers of Bowers & Merena. Now you understand partially why my will needs to be revised.
Part of my reasoning is the fact that I live on the East Coast and auctioning with an east coast firm makes sense for me. Also Dave Bowers represents another 50% of that reason alone.
Now for those who live in Texas or near Dallas, Texas, Heritage would offer some real advantages to Texans. But for Californians, I must admit that coinguy is going to help ANR gain a real foothold in California. Keep in mind that David Bowers used to enjoy California with Bowers and Ruddy and then Bowers & Merena before moving back to the east coast, this time to New Hampshire.
then i would do a commission basis with a company like
www.pinnacle-rarities.com todd imhof/doug winter
and in my opinion bottom line you will do just as good if not better than auction
all the greats the market insiders sold their personal holdings private treaty
q david bowers
mr. stack
david akers
and many more you will never hear about
Just my 2 cents...
Dennis
Like VOC Numismatics on facebook
If there were enough collector demand for one's material, it could kick auction prices up a bit as collectors and dealers working as agents for collectors might pay higher prices. Sometimes the auction sale itself creates enough of a buzz or frenzy that stimulates unexpectedly high bidding (ie. recent Jewell Collection), but I think this is the exception, rather than the rule.
Back to reality. Chances are the best prices for this type material would be paid by by an end user retail dealer, which, for most of my collection, would be somone specialized in rare date gold.
The recent sale of a very high-end New Orleans gold collection went virtually unnoticed by the numismatic community, excpet for those involved in NO gold. Perhaps the seller liked it this way. A similar but lesser collection (Acadiana Collection of New Orleans Gold, ANA Signature Sale in 1999) was been given the royal Heritage treatment. Neither party can be faulted by the way he chose to sell his collection.
To the points made by Laura, while I would hope that a collection built over years or decades would not necessitate an abrupt liquidation, the realities of divorce, illness, and other financial calamities might cause one to go for the quick known amount of cash rather than the unknown amount several months down the road.
If Laura buys your coin in auction versus buying your coin directly from you for retail sale, there's a pretty good chance that you left some money on the table with the auction company.
I think people do like to get their names preserved in a catalog. I must admit that I think it would be cool. I also realize that this notoriety is very ephemeral. Many great gold collections were built and dissembled over the past twenty years, but twenty years from now, which ones will be remembered. Bass and Eliasberg for sure. Beyond that, not many, even to specialists. The odds of lasting numismatic fame are miniscule. Who still remembers (or cares about) the fabulous Dallas Bank Collection?
My short answer is that I do not know what I will do for certain, and I hope that I will not have to make the decision anytime soon.
Personally, if I had to choose between the two top auction companies (Heritage or ANR), I would probably discuss the options with both companies and with trusted advisors. I see advantages to working with either firm.
definitely NOT heritage.
K S
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
Laura...you would have to make one hell of a case as to how selling to a dealer, who offer would be non-competitive, and looking to make money on the coins, is a better deal! If there are great coins, the mere fact that an auction creates competition is a major plus...certainly I have seen you and others get very aggressive with coins that you wanted in auctions...and I don't think that many of the "prices paid" are what would be offered initiallyin a private transaction. I also wouldn't want to get into a haggling match with a private sale. I say throw the coins to the crowd and let the final bid be the market.
"But if I had to because of duress or kidnapping, I would go with Heritage or ANR, at either spring or fall Long Beach or FUN or summer ANA."
In the case of a kidnapping, can you negotiate with the captors to wait until the next big auction before paying a ransom?
Fortunately I have never been on either side of this situation, it seems unlikely however.
<< <i>Personally I could NEVER consign or sell my coins because anything like that would imply I (or we) are not true collectors. And heaven forbid if anyone should insinuate such a thing. But if I had to because of duress or kidnapping, I would go with Heritage or ANR, at either spring or fall Long Beach or FUN or summer ANA.
roadrunner >>
I had a Registry set consigned at Long Beach and although they did a good job, it could have been better. Point. I had 9 buybacks which I politely sold for considerably more than my reserves, to fellow collectors, with no fees whatsoever except S/H.... but then the fellow collectors paid for that too.
The problem, if your coin doesn't sell at auction-its dead for a while. The dealers seem to remember. I have never gotten my price after that.
Is the collection 10 coins, or is it 2000? It is not just about the total value.
Professional counsel is appropriate for any serious collection.
I firmly believe in numismatics as the world's greatest hobby, but recognize that this is a luxury and without collectors, we can all spend/melt our collections/inventories.
eBaystore
Just make sure you offer it to more than one auction house!! (if an auction is your choice for liquidation) it will at least give you some leverage to use when working out a deal.
As far as buybacks.....if you put what the auction house considers a reasonable reserve on the coins, there should be no buyback fees.
Another idea is to hire someone to represent you when offering your collection to prospective buyers or auctioneers.
I recently put about $600,000 in nice 19th and 20th century coins coins up for auction. The auction house paid attention to my coins; and for the most part gave 'em good copy; and good photography.
They did very, very nicely on the 19th and early 20th century coins. The only exception were some nice but not very valuable Ben Franklin halves. They didn't understand some interesting albeit minor variety coins, but acquited themselves honorably on those too: They returned them after amicably discussing them with me.
Over all, of the coins they auctioned, they sold almost exactly 80%. On the average, I got my cost back plus 15.8%. And they didn't string me out on payments. Rather they sent the check out on exactly the day they said they would.
I was tickled pink. The firm was American Numismatic Rarities. I dealt with John Pack, and give them and him 4-star ratings.
Enjoy yourselves,
Just Having Fun
The difference as I see it is that in the auction venue you will be challenged by dozens of pros to bid near full value to take the coins home. But in buying 1 on 1 there are no "underbidder's" to force a stronger price. And the odds are that a collection offered up by a collector will likely be underpriced. If not, many specific coins will be underpriced and others will be overpriced. The underpriced coins will sell quickly. Personally I don't think either auction (after commissions of 13% or greater) nor fixed price sales will net you best value. I do however like Michael's idea of having them sold on consignment by a top dealer. Though in many cases they would much prefer to see you sell outright to them and may even balk at taking them via consignment. The few times I have tried "consignment" I was most disappointed to see that the sellers had jacked the prices way up to try and really score. They were not looking out for me to get the coins sold for a fair price.
In the end it is a very difficult playing field to maximize your dollar.
At least 90% or possibly 95+% leave plenty of money on the table.
roadrunner
<< <i>my stuff would do best w/ stack's or anr.
definitely NOT heritage.
Dorkkarl---Why not Heritage? >>
i've seen what heritage does w/ coins that aren't in plastic - straight to the plastic mill they go.
no thanks, i prefer a auction house that knows how to sell COINS, not just the slabs they are stuck in.
even if i believed heritage would get me more $$$, i'd still not consign MY coins to 'em.
of course, if i had nothing but a bunch of generic slabed state quarters or sacagaweenie coins, or blast-white morgans, yeah, but such is not what i collect.
K S