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Observing The Third Side of the Coin -- The Edge...

StuartStuart Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭✭✭
I remember reading in John Maben's grading articles that one should always grade the quality of the edge of the coin -- not just the obverse & reverse. I agree, and we all too often don't consider this "side of the coin".

If so, then have you ever noticed how you can see the edge of the coin through a PCGS transparent plastic holder, but that you cannot observe the edge of the coin in an NGC white plastic holder?

I would imagine that a number of coins that grade a bit lower than we think they should may have some sort of rim or edge defect which the grader observed, but that we cannot easily discern or even see at all.

Any other comments or opions out there in Coin Land ?

Stuart

Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

"Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"

Comments

  • BaleyBaley Posts: 22,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ... then again, an NGC coin could have Choice or Gem rims, and you wouldn't know that, either. image

    I agree the rim is important, Especially on lettered edge coins. I frequently crack them out.

    that said, unless there's something extraordinarily different about the grade of a coin's rims versus the obverse and reverse, the rims usually contribute only a couple of percent to a coin's final grade, if that.

    If the rims are damaged, of course, it's a different story, and I'm sure many slabs hide little edge nicks and rubs that cause a "choice for slabbed grade" coin to be "really" just average or low, because of an edge problem that must be factored into the coin's grade, but is not that apparent in the case.

    Someday PCGS will introduce a slab for lettered and fancy edge coins that shows the "third side"

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

  • dorkkarldorkkarl Posts: 12,692 ✭✭✭
    as you know, i've cracked out literally many hundreds of slabs, & i can tell you i've been burned multiple times by rim problems that were hidden by the plastic washer. it's 1 major reason i hate slabs (though i fully support 3d party grading).

    K S
  • BaleyBaley Posts: 22,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    here's a coin that I very badly wanted to examine the edge; had to break it out!

    image

    image

    image

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

  • XpipedreamRXpipedreamR Posts: 8,059 ✭✭


    << <i>... i fully support 3d party grading ).

    K S >>











    image



    He must have been on his best behavior back thenimage
  • LanLordLanLord Posts: 11,672 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Baley, thanks for posting the edge pics. That is one of the things that I truely enjoy, and miss about 18th and early 19th century coins.

    Lettered and fancy edges are so much more interesting than reeding and plain edges.

    And yes, taking them into account in the overall grade is very imporntant and I believe either all too often missed or excluded on purpose.
  • razorface1027razorface1027 Posts: 4,242 ✭✭
    Speaking of edges... Two monthes ago, I purchased a raw 78-CC Morgan Dollar from a trustworthy fellow. He claimed that it was MS-63; therefore, I purchased it. Much to my dismay, it appeared to me that if I were to send it to PCGS that it'd get (1) a lower grade or (2) Body-bagged (because you just never know when buying RAW) because of (a) Scuffs on cheek (b) Too much field chatter (obverse & reverse) and (c) The "Real kicker"...MASSIVE EDGE CHATTER. I thought alone it'd get a much lower grade for just the edge chatter despite the other two factors. When it was returned, it came back in a 63 holderimage Low and behold, NO EDGE CHATTER visible. IT MAGICALLY DISAPPEARED!image
    What is money, in reality, but dirty pieces of paper and metal upon which privilege is stamped?
  • I too am interested in how the edge is used in grading coins. I recently sent in two 1909 Lincoln Cents to PCGS. The coins are beautiful, No marks and would easily grade MS66RD or higher. The sent them back as suspect color. The only thing I can think of that made them body bag is the fact the rims were red instead of dark brown or black. I'd like some feedback on this. image
  • dizzleccdizzlecc Posts: 1,111 ✭✭✭
    Stu,

    I think you should take the time to count the number of reeds.

    The reed count will tell you the die variety and if the coin is a possible counterfeit.

    As far as grading, I think the big concern with reeding is the body bag factor more so than being taken down a grade.
  • nwcsnwcs Posts: 13,387 ✭✭✭
    The edge is somewhat interesting but I haven't found myself looking at the lettered edge coins I have all that much on the edge. The only time I'd care if it is in a slab would be for a variety indicator. But if the slab has the variety indicated, I'm content.
  • ttt
  • StuartStuart Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Damian: It would take quite a while to count all of the reeds on the coins in my collection, but you make a good point that it's a diagnostic that many of us do not consider or pay enough attention to.

    Stuart

    Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

    "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
  • dizzleccdizzlecc Posts: 1,111 ✭✭✭
    I have an idea. Assign that duty to your wife, that would be an excellant way to get her into the hobby.
  • StuartStuart Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Damian: imageimage

    Stuart

    Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal

    "Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
  • dizzleccdizzlecc Posts: 1,111 ✭✭✭
    After some research, the popular opinion is "that large and noticeable rim dents can lower the grade one full step.

    From the pictures illustrated, you would be able to see this even in a white plastic holder. So, I think coins in holders are safe. It's the raw coin that is up to your best judgement.

  • EVillageProwlerEVillageProwler Posts: 5,859 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Speaking of the third side, I recently met the guy who bought Russ Logan's edge mirrors. Nice guy. I introduced myself, and he stared at me a bit and smiled slightly knowingly. I confirmed to him that I was the underbidder on those edge mirrors and sitting a couple of rows in front of him.

    He didn't say anything about the evil stares I was giving him as I was trying to will him into submission!

    image

    EVP

    How does one get a hater to stop hating?

    I can be reached at evillageprowler@gmail.com

  • HootHoot Posts: 867
    Great edge pics Baley - thanks for showing those.

    I once sent a bust half to ANACS to be holdered before selling it on eBay (hated to do that). It had an edge device error with overlapping letters. I asked ANACS to attibute that on the label along with the Overton variety and they gladly accomodated for an extra 5 bucks. It was worth it to me simply to pass on the information to the next owner.

    Hoot
    From this hour I ordain myself loos'd of limits and imaginary lines. - Whitman
  • Conder101Conder101 Posts: 10,536


    << <i>But if the slab has the variety indicated, I'm content. >>


    Assuming the variety attribution is right. Unfortunately the only way to know is to crack it out.

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