ebay seller - User ID: greattoning

Goldmember · February 20, 2003 5:32AM

Check this user out, his ebay name is greattoning. Check out his auctions:

User ID: greattoning

This person is adding color to the pictures...Anyone please advise

Russ · February 20, 2003 5:34AM

He has been a frequent topic, and is actually a member of the forums. Those who have purchased from him have said that the coins look very much like his images.

Russ, NCNE

keithdagen · February 20, 2003 5:34AM

Define adding color?

Greattoning is a board member, but I can't remember his user ID here, but he freely admits that he does manipulate the images to put the coins in the best light. It's a common practice for coins that are wildly toned, and exrtemely difficult to scan or photograph.

Goldmember · February 20, 2003 5:35AM

I tracked a coin that he bougt from a ebay seller and he put it back up with colors.

kieferscoins · February 20, 2003 5:35AM

Please show us.

Cameron Kiefer

LucyBop · February 20, 2003 5:35AM

<< This person is adding color to the pictures >>

How do you know this?

Goldmember · February 20, 2003 5:37AM

Serial numbers match, I didnt bookmark the ebay page but I'll see if I can find it.

Russ · February 20, 2003 5:39AM

<< Please show us. >>

Ditto. If you're going to make an allegation like that, you should be providing the evidence. If he is, indeed, engaging in that type of activity, he should be exposed.

Russ, NCNE

Tonekiller · February 20, 2003 5:39AM

We have bought from him many times and the coins are great. He might add a little contrast to bring out the colors but thats no different than angling the coin to show the reflected light. Good return so no worries....IMO.

TBT

keithdagen · February 20, 2003 5:40AM

I tracked a coin that he bougt from a ebay seller and he put it back up with colors.

Who's to say he added colors, but just did a better job with his photography. May have been Russ who put a post up on the differences between scanning and photographing coins. You can take two toned coins and make them look completely different without adjusting them at all.

Goldmember · February 20, 2003 5:40AM

If you also check out the auctions, the first 2 Jeffersons. There is now way they could look like that. Looks like a neon show on the coin.

braddick · February 20, 2003 5:43AM

He sure didn't doctor the colors on this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=2776&item=2615683329

LucyBop · February 20, 2003 5:44AM

<< There is now way they could look like that. >>

Try going to a major show, you will change your opinion.....

Goldmember · February 20, 2003 5:46AM

<< He sure didn't doctor the colors on this one:
<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=2776&item=2615683329">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=2776&item=2615683329</A>

>>

Thats plate not a coin, if you couldn't tell....

Russ · February 20, 2003 5:46AM

<< You can take two toned coins and make them look completely different without adjusting them at all. >>

This is absolutely true. With just lighting and angle, the same coin can look radically different.

Russ, NCNE

keithdagen · February 20, 2003 5:46AM

Example One (Scanned flat, no Photoshop tweaks)

Example Two (Scanned with a 15% angle, no tweaks)

Example Three (Photo Two with some Photoshop contrast and brightness adjustments most likely)

All three pics are of the same coin, using different equipment and techniques.

LucyBop · February 20, 2003 5:48AM

<< Thats plate not a coin, if you couldn't tell.... >>

Braddick was joking, if you couldn't tell....

Russ · February 20, 2003 5:51AM

Here's another example:

It's the same coin. The first is as it appeared in the auction from which I bought it. The second is my image. There was no software manipulation at all.

Russ, NCNE

braddick · February 20, 2003 5:52AM

<< 

<< Thats plate not a coin, if you couldn't tell.... >>

Braddick was joking, if you couldn't tell.... >>

Thanks Lucy. I guess my (unedited)

wasn't BIG enough.

gmarguli · February 20, 2003 5:54AM

His forum ID is MrD. I purchased from him and the color looked close to what I expected.

He freely admits taking pictures that show off the colors the best. You might have to rotate the coin in the light to see those colors, but they are there.

ah · February 20, 2003 5:54AM

There certainly a lot of color in them thar coins!!

gmarguli · February 20, 2003 5:55AM

Russ, those Kennedy half holders are great. They produce nice rainbow toning.

Clankeye · February 20, 2003 5:56AM

I watched with interest as Greattoning sold a commem I used to own last week (not for me, hadn't owned it in a while). I was glad to see this because I got to judge the presentation of a coin which I was familiar with first hand. It was fine. He did an accurate job representing it. He got all the color out of it, but it is color that was there. I do not believe whoever ended up buying it would have felt cheated.

Clankeye

Russ · February 20, 2003 5:57AM

Greg,

Yeah, after I got my first one, I've been on the lookout for them. Have four so far.

Russ, NCNE

Dog97 · February 20, 2003 8:24AM

Those were some good examples keithdagen provided.
greattoning did post on this board that he takes several shots of the coins and uses the best ones for his listings or words to that effect.
I'm always skeptical of the wild colored coins because I have bought some from board members that looked just like the coin and others that I wondered how did they make the coin turn that color for the pict because it had none of the flourescent glowing colors of the pict

clackamas · February 20, 2003 8:33AM

I am sorry but most of those coins are ugly. I can see paying a slight premium for a nice looking coin but I can't for the life of me see why improper storage of a coin for an extened period of time can actually add value. I like white, as struck and toned rainbows. You can have that mottled crap.

rainbowroosie · February 20, 2003 8:52AM

Greattoning does a "great" job with scanning rainbow coins, which is incredibly difficult to do. As for the colors, they are almost always very close to what the coin really looks like.

I get a real kick out of comments like "the colors couldn't look like that." Reason: they DO look like that. Many of the wildest coins he's been selling are MY coins. I bought them over the past 20 years precisely because they WERE WILD TONED. Mr. D will be selling most of my Merc set 1936-45 in upcoming auctions. Average grade is MS 67.4 and they will all look "outrageous" in his photos because they are OUTRAGEOUS!!!! Look for the little NGC "*" on many because NGC liked them, too.

As for the nickles, I bought the two crazy color ones from GSAGUY (who knows a little bit about color). They are COOL looking coins and the REDS are REDS. Mr D did an amazing job of getting them to show off their unique colors. I know of NO ONE, I repeat NO ONE who scans color coins better than Mr. D.

rainbowroosie

Tonekiller · February 20, 2003 9:01AM

<< I know of NO ONE, I repeat NO ONE who scans color coins better than Mr. D.

rainbowroosie >>

Now come on!

TBT

rainbowroosie · February 20, 2003 9:04AM

TBT,
There are some very close "second places!!"

Petescorner · February 20, 2003 9:44AM

On one hand, I can certainly appreciate Forum members vouching for this seller.

But on the other hand, I think that unless NGC started using blue slabs, then this auction has some seriously "tweaked" images.

Auction

lablover · February 20, 2003 10:10AM

I own a number of Roosevelt's that look just like his scans...they came from original US Double Mint Sets. Rotate the coin and the colors just spring to life. I have no problem believing these are as they appear.
LabLover

Colorfulcoins · February 20, 2003 12:49PM

Might as well chime in as some of the coins he has listed right now are mine. I send those coins to Dick as he's darned good. I can tell you that he sends preview pictures to me of the coins before he lists them to make sure that I, as the coins owner, think they look ok. I have on more than one occasion asked Dick to redo his pictures as they weren't accurate in my opinion. Every time I've asked, he's taken pictures until I'm satisfied. I'll stick to my guns that he's fair and square......but he does try darned hard to make a coin look as good as it possibly can - we all try to do the same - he just does better. Unfortunately, he won't share his "secret sauce" on how he does it........I've asked.

K6AZ · February 20, 2003 1:36PM

First, before I throw in my two cents, there is no question in my mind that these coins are naturally toned. I bring this up because what I am going to say might be used by the defenders of AT sellers.

Naturally toned coins are extremely difficult to image. I would estimate I have to take 10 shots at each side of the coin before I come up with a shot that I think accurately reflects the colors on the coin. A lot of times, I have to adjust the contrast and brightness of the image to match it to what the coin looks like. Still, there is no way to get an image to look exactly like the coin, so when I sell a toned coin, I include a return privilege. I would never buy a toned coin on eBay without the ability to return it.

gsaguy · February 20, 2003 1:36PM

I have to agree with rainbowroosie and others on the forum re greattoning and the overall accuracy of this pics.

After selling a couple of really cool toned Jeffersons to rainbowroosie at FUN, greattoning called me after seeing the coins. I sent him a small sampling which he bought (and no haggling on the price either, I might mention).

I've since seen him list a coin or two and I felt he did a good job of capturing the colors.

Other forum members (sellers) that I believe do a very good job are TBT, DrewU, and Morganluver. I mention these guys because I've bought coins from all of them based on scans. I've also found that Braddick and Mike Billy do a good job as well. If I forgot anyone, my apologies.

Anyway, my 2 cents.

Thanks,

GSAGUY

K6AZ · February 20, 2003 1:51PM

gsaguy- I hope you buy some of mine!

I am gearing up to sell several hundred toned Morgans.

coppercoins · February 20, 2003 1:51PM

Having had a number of years experience with Photoshop, I can see what has been done to some of those images, especially the overly colorful nickels. A setting called hue/saturation can be used to enrich color or diminish color without actually changing the color itself. That's what has been done with those images - the saturation was increased. I can tell by the color of the slab.

I also noticed on a couple of other coins I bothered looking at that the artist found the sharpen tool and way overused it around the date on a mercury dime and a peace dollar. The date only on those two coins looks VERY grainy, and the sharpen tool is what causes that.

In my opinion, the photos are enhanced to promote the coins. Probably not to the point that some go (removing scratches and the like) but enhanced enough (and obviously to someone with experience at it) to warrant some suspition as to whether any of the images are of the coins themselves without any additional button clicking to make them look unnaturally good.

To add, I do enhance most of the photos I take in one way or another, but the way I enhance them is to make the image look as dead-on accurate to the exact color and tone of the coin as possible. The photos in the auctions subject in this thread are what I used to end up with when I was making mistakes.

K6AZ · February 20, 2003 2:00PM

Coppercoins- the fact remains that no matter how good your camera, lighting, and photo editing skills, it is nearly impossible to make an image look exactly like the coin. That is why I offer returns on every toned coin I sell, and insist on them when I buy.

stman · February 20, 2003 2:07PM

I would say TBT's images look exactly like the coin looks in person. From what I've experienced so far.
As far as Greattoning images, I really don't care for them. Too pastel looking. The colors might be all there, but not all those coins are pastel looking IMO.

coppercoins · February 20, 2003 2:10PM

<< Coppercoins- the fact remains that no matter how good your camera, lighting, and photo editing skills, it is nearly impossible to make an image look exactly like the coin. That is why I offer returns on every toned coin I sell, and insist on them when I buy. >>

No arguement here. Then again, your statement doesn't contradict anything I said, either.

braddick · February 20, 2003 2:11PM

Bryan, Thanks- that was cool of you. I try to photo the coin that allows the viewer a fully educated look as to what it is, good and not so good. I also like to show the holder because it allows the potential bidder to know the coin insert number and also to compare the color of the coin to the color of the paper slab insert (very telling).

I could work on centering and lighting a bit, but overall what you see is what you get and maybe even then the coin will be slightly better upon its arrival to the new owner. I haven't had a return yet.

jom · February 20, 2003 2:11PM

Just my opinion here: All those pictures with EXCEPTION of the two Jeff nickels on top do NOT look like they've been "saturated" at all.

As to the two Jefferson's the pictures are quite odd...the 45 is VERY odd but that isn't the problem I have with those coins. If those are true representations of the coins then I believe they are both AT. This is not an indictment of the seller whatsoever, he is selling the coins in holders....it is just my opinion. They are both very pretty coins however....

jom

gsaguy · February 20, 2003 2:21PM

No thanks necessary Braddick....just stating the facts as I see them.

GSAGUY

Mrpawn · February 20, 2003 2:42PM

I too can attest that in order to show a tonedcoin's true "colors" some manipulation of the photo is often needed.

My photos have not reached my expectations so I have none to show you but I have shot and worked on one coin in particular several dozen times trying to capture it's "true colors"

braddick · February 20, 2003 2:58PM

GSAGUY- Now, if I could only have my Morgans looking like your ICON!

relayer · February 20, 2003 5:06PM

What a difference angle and lighting make...

TONEDDOLLARS · February 20, 2003 6:58PM

Did we forget annacondas photo abilitys

Fairlaneman · February 20, 2003 8:40PM

<< 

<< This person is adding color to the pictures >>

How do you know this? >>

I know first hand as I sold him a coin and then it hit Ebay later on. The man does not Add Color but some how just enhances the scan to show the color that a coin has. If I was a buyer I believe I would be very wary of getting a coin that looks like the scan. For sure the coin I sold him had some Great color but his scan just plain did not look like the coin if you had it in your hand.

This is not a knock on him but just the way I feel about highly enhanced photos both on Ebay and Web Sites.

Ken

Morganluver · February 20, 2003 11:22PM

GSAGUY

Thanks for the honorable mention, I appreciate it. It is difficult to properly image toned coins. I also try to be as exact as I can be matching color in hand to the pic, however, instead of "overstating" the color I feel more comfortable erring on the side of "understatement". That way the buyer will be pleasantly surprised instead of thinking that the pic got every ounce of color when turned at every conceivable angle. In short, I'd rather have the buyer say WOW! instead of WOW?

ebay seller - User ID: greattoning

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