Coin Vault/Cameo Coin, both overpriced!

wallstreetman · February 16, 2003 3:37PM

I just have to say something about Cameo Coin! This dealer has been taking advantage of Newbies ever since I can remember. If you buy from them, YOURE PROBABLY PAYING TOO MUCH!Example

wallstreetman · February 16, 2003 3:42PM

Another Example Tulving had this for $399 with free shipping when Cameo Coin was selling it for $600!

TommyB · February 16, 2003 3:47PM

here we go again!

RKKay · February 16, 2003 3:54PM

It is interesting that Cameo Coin is located in CHAGRIN Falls.

gary · February 16, 2003 8:58PM

Wallstreet,
You are correct that the market controls the supply,but haveing bought all the MS AGE's Tuling offered I am in deep trouble for none of sets are complete from him.
CALLED TULING WEEKLY FOR A YEAR AND MOST DATES ARE OUT OF STOCK......NO MORE,,,,GONE
TULING MOVES ON UNLESS A SPECIAL PURCHASE IS MADE...
Some forum members have capalized no this and done well....
THE AMERICAN MARKET PROCESSS AT WORK...

Gary

Cameo CC · February 16, 2003 9:55PM

Well - I knew an attack like this would arise.

I think wallstreetman has every right to make his opinion know but I do not agree with it.

I would ask him to call me so I could explain how we come up with a price. If he then decides to continue with his opinion, it ok with me.

To date, (at least to my knowledge) he has not call me to express his opinion nor to help us on pricing and I think it is unfair for him to make such a claim with the knowledge of how a price is determined.

For example is it unfair to buy a 1963 Lincoln cent PR70 DCAM PCGS for $34,100.00.

We try to be open minded about pricing and would hope that should he call me, he to, will be open minded about pricing.

And just a correction - it is Cameo CC and not Cameo Coins - they are two different companies and have no relationship to each other.

Todd

Dimetime · February 16, 2003 10:04PM

Just my 2 cents worth. Cameo CC sells only very high end coins. I've dealt with Todd several times. The coins I've bought have always been rock solid quality for the grade. Bottom line is still, know your coin and pay what you think it's worth. Don't buy if you think it's overpriced.

bigt · February 16, 2003 11:21PM

My nickels worth,
I ordered and received a pr68dcam 71-s {nickel} from Cameo CC, sight unseen. The coin is all there and PQ ++++
It could easily be a 69 {IMHO} and I"ve looked at a few

Again IMHO they have quality coins and are an asset to the hobby.

Tim Allen

wingedliberty · February 16, 2003 11:48PM

The only experience I have with Cameo CC is second hand with friends who collect similar material.
Their response is that Cameo CC has quality coins , but that they are overpriced. My surfing their website and seeing what they sell on Ebay and in CoinWorld confirms the overpriced part.

Brian.

Cameo CC · February 17, 2003 12:55AM

I now really feel part of the PCGS Message Board. I received my first negative thread.

I do want to thank those who responded, both positively and negatively. I think it is right to bring up pricing and it serves the coin industry.

Perhaps, I would recommend, that this thread would be better served if the pricing issue were more general instead of focusing on one company. One could make the same claim, which has been suggest of Cameo CC, for any other coin dealer. It is not exclusive to Cameo CC.

What concerns me is the claim that we are overpriced without any analytical or historical evidence. I would ask those who suggest that we are overpriced to do research on the average cost each coin sells for and provide this evidence to the Message board. We have over 1000 items in current inventory. To pick out a handful item items and then generalize these items to say that most or all items are overpriced is wrong or to just make a blanket statement that we are over priced without any historical or analytical evidence is wrong as well.

Second, very few people can update the trends on the modern material. There are many reasons for this, which space does not allow me to list, but one I will mention is the 1996 American Silver Eagle MS69 PCGS. Six months ago, the coin sold on ebay between $400.00 and $500.00. Today the coin is only a $100.00 to $200.00 coin. Why, someone submitted a large volume and the population went from say 100 to 500. The market was flooded with the coin and destroyed the marketability of the coin. The opposite could be said on other coins.

Third, as a business we have the right to make a fair profit. Consider the overhead we have to pay for or the reject coins which did not grade out.

Anyways, I appreciate you comments.

Todd

stujoe · February 17, 2003 1:09AM

I have never dealt with Todd and I don't think he sells the kind of stuff I usually buy. However, I must comend him on his professionalism in this thread.

I don't know a lot about Tulving either except that I thought they were primarily a bullion company. I guess they sell some slabbed too.

ARCO · February 17, 2003 1:10AM

It is impossible to overprice coins! All values are relative to what the market will pay. If someone through agressive advertising reaches an audience that is not reached through the traditional numismatic channels, and can charge double, triple or a hundred times what the coin would sell for at a coin show, then that is a free market system.

However, if the coin is touted as being worth a certain amount and truly isn't in the marketplace, and all like examples sell for less, then that is deceptive advertising. Anyone has a right to sell any item at any price if there is a willing buyer.

7.59 Million for a $20.00 Gold coin? Now that is obscene to me!

Tyler

tjkillian · February 17, 2003 1:15AM

$39,000 for a 1963 Lincoln cent is obscene as well. Capitalism, supply and demand. As long as there is no deception.

Tom

wallstreetman · February 17, 2003 1:16AM

Ive only compared you to Tulving so far, this will give you an idea of the coins Im talking about! I am currently collecting Franklins, can you give me some idea of your pricing on these, I cant remember seeing an ad(auction) for this HOT item? Im not talking about rare, one of a kind coins(1933 St Gauden), I will let someone else give their opinion on those!

flaminio · February 17, 2003 1:33AM

Cameo CC has the right to price their coins however they like. The marketplace will decide whether the prices are too high or not, not wallstreetman. eBay is one of the purer, Adam-Smithian marketplaces in the world, and if Cameo CC does consistently overprice their coins, they will find themselves with no buyers and out of business, or they will have to adjust their prices to match the market.

dorkkarl · February 17, 2003 1:42AM

i don't happen to like cameocc's coins, but overpriced? c'mon dude. he could price 'em at $3000, & if someone wants 1 at that price, then it's priced right, & the competition is under-priced.

K S

jbsteven · February 17, 2003 1:53AM

I completely agree on the notion that ANYONE can price WHATEVER they are selling at ANY price they want to. I own a business where most companies charge about the same price for our services and this is the market for this service. Clients pay what they want to pay. We have competitors that have much higher prices and some people pay those high prices. As a business owner you have to make the decision to sell a lower amount of product or service at a higher price or you can sell more products or services at a lower price. I tending to lean toward a lower price and higher volume as this creates more customers and more repeat customers create more sales for the company.

There are sellers on Ebay that buy coins and mark up the price in multiples because of the reputation they have created with repeat cutomers. These people have high quality items and can charge a premium because they can find the nice items and can make deals happen. They bring the nice products to the market and the market decides if they want the items at the advertised price.

LucyBop · February 17, 2003 1:54AM

I just went to Cameo CC's website and looked at all of their pricing on their Frankies........

What do you think I found??????????

All of the pricing I saw is HepKitty approved and I saw no problems what-so-ever and even saw some very decent deals...

nwcs · February 17, 2003 1:56AM

If they're priced too highly for you, the answer is simple: do not buy one. I wonder why you were motivated to make this thread? You don't state a case, then prove the case with sufficient information, then suggest a course of action.

littlewicher · February 17, 2003 2:03AM

They can price their coins however they want. It is their perogative to do so. If you don't like the prices, then simply don't buy them. There is no point in making a whole garbage thread just because you object to the prices. This is an absurdity and an embarassment to the board and the people who post here. I've heard many good things from customers of Todd. They deal in nice, PQ coins.

Bigern · February 17, 2003 2:15AM

It is impossible to overprice coins! All values are relative to what the market will pay. If someone through agressive advertising reaches an audience that is not reached through the traditional numismatic channels, and can charge double, triple or a hundred times what the coin would sell for at a coin show, then that is a free market system.

This is it in a nut shell the "American Way". I agree that Todd has been very professional in his responses. My question is if the coin is overpriced why cant they just say "No Thanks". If they dont know its overpriced to bad I had to learn the hard way and I am sure everyone else did also.

jbsteven · February 17, 2003 2:23AM

something to add to my post above is:

When a major work of art is sold for 10-50 million dollars then this is the market for this item and someone CHOOSE to pay that much for it. same thing with coins.

tompkins · February 17, 2003 2:25AM

Some of Cameo CC's coins appear overpriced. But I can say (from first hand experience) that their coins are generally top quality and they are very honest about what they are selling. And, I might add, the several dealings I have had with both Gary and Todd (both eBay auctions and purchases by telephone) have been very pleasant, and problem free. Don't buy the ones that you think are overpriced. But anything you buy, I suspect you will be happy with.

Pete

relayer · February 17, 2003 3:52AM

You can price a $10 coin for $100,000. It doesn't mean anybody will pay that much

DCAMFranklin · February 17, 2003 4:08AM

Last time I checked, Todd or anyone else at CameoCC, was not reaching through the phone/cable lines and grabbing newbies by the throat and forcing them to bid on their coins. CameoCC places a price on their coins and people buy them or they pass on them. It is each buyer's responsibility to know the quality and determine if that is a fair price. If they find the price to be fair, then they bid/buy the coin. If not, then they pass.

Right now, I can go to any of 5 Cadillac dealerships and ask the price on the exact same model car, with the exact same equipment, and I will get 5 different prices. Right? Yet, some people think the coin business HAS to be different.

If CameoCC is able to ask and receive prices that allow them to operate more profitably than other dealers, my hat is off to them. Good for them! Now, he can't expect me to buy from him unless he accepts my lower offer. It is MY responsibility to recognize a price higher than I feel acceptable for the coin. It is MY responsibility to either pass or make an offer. It is Todd's responsibility to look at his business' sales that month and determine whether to accept my lower offer, make a counter offer or reject it. It is MY responsibility to promptly pay for the coin and then NOT whine about it.

vam44 · February 17, 2003 4:51AM

People! Wake up and smell the coffee!
All pcgs graded coins are the same, a paticular date/mint coin at a certain grade is identical to another, as long as they`re in a pcgs holder!

To charge any more for the same item in the same grade in a pcgs holder is just plain CAPITALISM!

coinrookie · February 17, 2003 6:40AM

Their prices on proof Ikes are right inline with most dealers. Personally, I think every dealers prices are too high

jbsteven · February 17, 2003 6:50AM

vam44

not ALL coins that are graded the same in a pcgs holder are the same as another one. I had a 1885 O morgan that was in a 66 holder and upgraded to a 67, price difference was $1200. was this coin the same as another ms66 in another pcgs holder.......nope

Dimetime · February 17, 2003 8:35AM

Cameo CC exonerated. Your reputation is hereby fully restored. Not that I questioned it anyway.

toothpuller · February 17, 2003 8:55AM

I bought a couple of Sacs from Gary and Todd for my daughter and the pricing was off - they were grossly UNDERPRICED compared to what I see on eBay.

Coin Vault/Cameo Coin, both overpriced!

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