What causes hairlines on proof Frankie's?

sinin1

I have a 1955 proof that is beautiful but there are many hairlines on the obverse fields. They are very small but definitely visible when checking out the cartwheel.

At first I thought it had been cleaned but now I am wondering if these are a result of die polishing - are there any tell-tale signs I should look for? I can not find any marks going through letters and continuing on the other side.

Baley

tilt the coin: are the marks raised or lowered? does it look like the result of wiping, as with a cloth?


post a pic if you can.

LucyBop

According to Rick T's great book on proof coinage, he states that hairlines typically result from mishandling after the coin was struck. However some hairlines are actually struck into the coin during the minting process. He goes on to say that the vast majority of proof Franklins and virtually all of the 1950-53 proofs have em..

This is why a DCAM in a pr68 is very tough in the Franklin series, a pr69 is pure heaven!

Hairlines are a grade killer.

Russ

Probably the same thing that causes them on 1964 proof Kennedys. I wish I knew. They are VERY common on the Accented Hairs. More so than the second obverse die.

Edit: I see that the answer materialized while I was pecking.

Russ, NCNE

sinin1

I have included 4 photos (I hope) - 2 of the proof 1955 and 2 of a MS coin (1949) with similar problems - I just got the MS coin last week and emailed the seller to see if I could return it - I thought scratched/cleaned - his reply was"

the mint cleaned the dies off with a wire brush so the hairlines you see are not from cleaning of the coin, but cleaning of the die before the coin was minted, resulting in hairlines on the coin

or something to that extent

I have a dime showing die cleaning very well -> I also read somewhere that the dies were cleaned with emery cloth and so only the field is affected but not the devices -> is this coin specific? Did they clean dime dies differently than half dollar dies in the late 40's-mid 50's?

Should I see hairlines on the letters and Franklins face and Bell?

What do these hairlines do to the grade if I send them to PCGS? These lines are too small for me to tell if they go up or down, even under 60x magnification

Baley

IMO those lines are tiny scratches from abrasive cleaning or wiping, and PCGS would no-grade the coins. sorry.

Russ

<< <i>What do these hairlines do to the grade if I send them to PCGS? >>



More than just a very few, and you won't grade higher than 64 no matter how good the rest of the coin is. They are VERY hard on hairlines with proof coins.



<< <i>IMO those lines are tiny scratches from abrasive cleaning or wiping. >>



I don't know about the business strike, since that's not my area. But I have seen that type of hairlining on proofs directly out of the mint celo plenty of times.

Russ, NCNE

airplanenut

Hair, of course!

Gilbert

Polishing of the die with wire brushes might lead to a coin with die polishing lines (minute raised lines on the surface) but hairlines generally come for wiping, sliding against something or otherwise mishandling.

Franklin proofs have been known to acquire some hairlining from the mint packing, particularly the little bags stapled together in the boxed sets, but those in cello can also be damaged by rough handling. Even cotton gloves are capable of imparting minute scratches (hairlines). Mirrored fields are quite delicate and require the utmost care.

Russ

<< <i>Mirrored fields are quite delicate and require the utmost care. >>



Yep, and on the pre-1970 stuff, very deep = VERY delicate.

Russ, NCNE

pontiacinf

well mine were caused with a q-tip and ms70...which i think 66tbird still has it showcased in his collection.

sinin1

So what happens to the proof field if you dip in jeweluster or something? Do the hairlines get smaller? or do you just make a not so good coin worse?

supercoin

sinin1, dipping won't do anything to help hairlines, and in the case of a toned coin can make them more obvious.

On the coins you posted, the lines extend through the lettering, which leads me to believe it's likely post-strike damage. Normally die polish would be seen on the fields and not in small areas like lettering, because on the die the fields are the highest part and it would be difficult to polish inside the indented letters.

If you can tell in person whether the lines are raised or indented, that would give you a definitive answer.

As to your original question about where hairlines come from on mint-packaged proofs, I don't know either... my guess would be it's from mint workers packaging them up while wearing cotton gloves, or maybe even sometimes wiping the coins with a cloth before packaging them.