White Whale: Harpooned, Skewered, Filleted, Conquered! UPDATE!!!!!
thedutymon11
Posts: 634 ✭✭✭✭
Afternoon,
Just picked up what I would consider one of my Biggest White Whales of all time, going back to my start with Non Sports Cards 25-30 years ago.
The Best part is that I was Not Sure this Item even Existed! I have been tracking Auction Houses, E-bay and lots of other Vintage Sources for year and years and have Never Seen One, Not One. Although I could have missed one!. And until the E-Bay listing this last week Proved it Does Exist. I just didn't know for sure if any had stood the test of time!!
This is of Course is the Entire 24 card UnCut Sheet of 1944 Gum Inc. American Beauties 24 card Sheet, Entire Set on One Sheet! I have 4 UnCut 9 Card sheets of this set and over the years have owned another 15-20 of the same, but Never a Complete Uncut Set/Sheet! Never Even Seen One! Just Hoped!
I never have seen anything but the Uncut 9 Card Sheets cut different and with no Rhyme or Reason as to the Cutting. Anybody have any ideas why these sheets would be cut almost always an 9 Card Sheets (Never as 8 Card Sheets )?
So Here it is First of my Current 4 9 Card UnCut Sheets
And Now the Sheet. According to the Lady I bought it from who I had a long Conversation with about the Sheet. She got it Framed and under Glass years ago and never noticed that the 8 Card Sheet in the Frame were actually folded twice underneath the backing and in the Frame and was intact with 24 cards 2 Folds. Her husband was poking around on it and discovered it was an uncut sheet! So the Sheet was folded once and surprisingly there is not an excessive amount of damage due to it being folded. And really who cares when you own one of a Kind Piece!
Thanks
YeeHaw!
Neil
Comments
Congrats!!!! Those panels are great.
Congratulations, man. You may have the only one in existence.
Very cool! congrats!
very nice! always loved the key hole peep card.
Those are great!! Congrats!
Congrats on your find!
Happy for you Neil Great Stuff!
very very nice
1948-76 Topps FB Sets
FB & BB HOF Player sets
1948-1993 NY Yankee Team Sets
Congratulations! One of, it not the last set (s) marketed to adult collectors, before many years of marketing to kids that's still a stigma in the hobby.
Way to go!!!!!!!!!
Given the orientation of the cards on your nine card sheets, this 24 card sheet is actually part of a still larger uncut sheet, right?
Congrats!
Yee-hah!
eBay Store
Greg Maddux #1 Master SetGreg Maddux #2 Basic Set
Beautiful piece of history. GREAT addition to your collection.
Seems like the sheet would have to be at least 6x6. I numbered your full set sheet 1-24, and then I looked at your 9 card partial sheets as well as several others from Google. All the 9 card sheets I could find are circled below:
The actual full printed sheet could be even larger, but it must contain this 6x6 grid.
That's awesome! Museum worthy!! Congrats!
www.questfortherookiecup.com
Yes ,
That is what I figured, thanks for taking the time to Mock up that Lay-Out! When I first calculated the Sheets I have and the One on E-Bay and the last 2-3 each 9 Card Sheet Lots Sales at the AH's, using this 24 Card Sheet, I knew that this was not the end of my quest! I've known for quite awhile that Even when/if an uncut sheet showed up, it could just complicate matters!
Using the Layout you have figured out brings up other Questions as to why so many were cut into 9 Card sheets, which begs to offer why not more 8 cards 2x4 card sheets cut horizonailly. Or do you think this could have been printed with a Single Sheet of 48 Cards, Two complete Sets, and does your grid above work in that scenario? Or some other scenario and they printed the sheet 1 1/2, so half the set is actually short printed? Just throwing to see what sticks to the wall. And then throw into the mix the Fact that these were cut up into lots of individual 12 Cards, Rubber banded and sold for a Nickel per 12 cards at Retailers.
Anecdotally, one time an Old Timer told me they were printed in 36 cards Sheets and then Cut at the Manufacturer into 9 Card Sheets which is almost Square and would ease in shipping and delivery to Retailers in the mid 40's. I would really be curious to see if this scenario works?
So the Quest Continues!!!!!!!!
OH! And Thanks for Adding Another White Whale to my Hunt......Not!!
Thanks All, Appreciate it!
YeeHaw!
Neil
Neil,
Based on the available evidence, there could be a 48 card sheet consisting of two complete sets. I would think if the first two columns were double prints, that would manifest in PSA populations.
Here is a record of the PSA 8/9/10 total population for each card. It seems telling that the three toughest cards are all in the fourth column. Also, there are eight cards in the first two columns with populations higher than ALL the cards in columns 3 and 4. So columns 1 and 2 being double prints seems plausible.
Correct me I am wrong please, but doesn't that also keep alive the theory of a Sheet with 1& 1/2 Sets per sheet. Your Grid above supports that as well, with all the 9 Card Sheets available for consideration. But, this could be proved Not viable with One Sheet that doesn't fit what has already been identified.
And what could we learn from any other 1940's Gum Inc. Non Sports Sets Sheets, or even Sports by Gum Inc, mid 40's sheets would tell us something? What Company did Gum Inc. become or did they just fizzle out?
Thanks
YeeHaw!
Neil
@thedutymon
Yes, I think the evidence does suggest the 1 1/2 sets per sheet with the first two columns being double prints. I guess it could even be a seven column sheet with just the 4th column being short printed. That column does have the seemingly tougher titles.
I did poke around looking for other contemporary Gum Inc sets but couldn’t find any with so few subjects.
Gum, Inc. was founded by Jacob Warren Bowman.
I thought I remembered there being a Bowman, Gum Inc connection, so did Gum Inc. fold into Bowman, although Bowman was a Player in the 30's or bought them out?
Thanks
YeeHaH!
Neil
Sorry. After his 1941 Play Ball cards he changed the branding when paper again was available (1948).
this is awesome!
I love stuff like this
Kingnascar's PSA Sets
Kingnascar's PSADNA Sets
Afternoon,
I got some other shots that show off the Damage done by the Folding and are these Scans are actually much clearer than my Scans.
YeeHaw!
Neil
Afternoon,
Update: "I do believe" that I have solved the mystery of the Original Manufactured Sheet!
If you look at Huggins & Scott 11/21/2011 Auction, lot 741 is for 4 (Four) each 9 Cards Uncut SheetsI If you transpose those sheets onto my 24 cards Complete Set Sheet, I am pretty sure this leans Heavily towards there being 36 Cards in the Original Sheet with 1/2 the Set being Double Prints and I/2 of Set being Short Prints. As PaulMaul pointed out above, this theory is borne out by the Populations of Graded at PSA!
So in my World, my Impossible Unicorn 20+ years journey in the Making, has now Morphed into a Quest for the ever elusive 36 Card Sheet, probably doesn't Exist, but for Now I have the Only 24 Card Sheet ever to appear on Fee-Bay!
Any Thoughts!?
Thanks
YeeHaw!
Neil
Looks like a Zodiac cipher.
Kiss me twice.....let's party.
Ah....Growing up in California in the 60's and 70's. Serial Killer Capitol of the World I remember in High School having pools to see how many victims there would end up being with like, Juan Corona, The Black Widow lady who murdered and buried her victims in her Garden in Downtown Sac. , Old SSN guys. I lived like 2 Blocks from her house. Or that Vampire Killer dude! Oh the Times!!! Zodiac Was BIG in the mid/late 60's
YeeHaw!
Neil
When my parents were in their 70s I was helping them clean out my dad's Navy trunk from WWII. Among the things in there were some American Beauties cards which were very quickly confiscated and tossed out by my mother. If I would have known they had more than "admiration" value, I would have fished them out of the trash can!