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Lord Marcovan's "Eclectic Box of 20" Collection (old index thread, 2013-16)

lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited September 22, 2019 6:40AM in World & Ancient Coins Forum
As of 2017, I am no longer updating this old index thread, since the late-2016 software change on these forums wrecked the formatting and made posting and editing more difficult.

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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Archives of the set as it appeared in past incarnations, to show how it has evolved:



    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 09/15/16

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 05/26/16

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 12/01/15

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 10/06/15

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 03/17/15

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 11/06/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 10/24/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 10/22/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 10/11/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 04/29/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 03/18/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 03/08/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 03/04/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 03/03/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 03/01/14

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 08/07/13

    ~ LordM Box of 20 archive, 07/25/13



    November 2015: You will note that some of the earlier comments people posted below refer to an "ADAM" collection (this was an acronym for "Ancient, Dark Age, and Medieval"), and is what I called this set in its earliest incarnations. At the time, I had just changed over from a Roman Twelve Caesars collection so the set was still mostly ancient coins then. It had not yet evolved into the much more "Eclectic" Box of 20 it is today.




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  • SmEagle1795SmEagle1795 Posts: 2,135 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I love the toning on your Antoninus Pius!
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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    That toned Antoninus Pius caught my eye. I bought it in an ANACS EF45 holder, and cracked it out, hoping NGC would like it better than ANACS. They didn't. Oh, well. The holder matches the others, now. I don't really care that much about the technical label grades anyway. As time goes on, I'll likely focus on that a little more. Right now, this box is pretty eclectic and sort of cobbled together from a bunch of leftovers and stray coins. In time, I hope to improve the quality of what's in the box, but it will probably remain an eclectic (almost eccentric) collection.

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  • SYRACUSIANSYRACUSIAN Posts: 6,445 ✭✭✭✭
    Another good idea. Neat! image
    Dimitri



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  • oakcoinoakcoin Posts: 187 ✭✭
    "Box of twenty". Sounds like a great idea! I will definitely use that.
  • WillieBoyd2WillieBoyd2 Posts: 5,034 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Venetian Grosso looks like a very nice coin!

    image
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  • SwampboySwampboy Posts: 12,873 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Terrific start to a your "ADAM" box of 20 LM.
    For some reason the Hadrian denarius speaks to me.

    Love the look of it, and the Orodes II, and the Antoninus Pius ... image

  • percybpercyb Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭
    Nice collection. Thanks for posting!
    "Poets are the unacknowledged legislators of the world." PBShelley
  • Cool idea, can't wait to see how this progresses..
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Millennium! Hey, Steve! I was just thinkin' about you the other day, and wondering how you were doin'. Been diggin' any? I got a little video camera that mounts on a headband, so I might try to start doing some dig videos like yours. Gimme a call sometime, maybe we can go put the coil to the soil.

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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭

    image

    The Lithuanian piece arrived yesterday and I am very pleased with it.

    It covers most of the bases for me:

    1. Quality/eye appeal: very nice- looks better than the pictures and has a light satiny sort of luster not seen in the photos.
    2. Historical interest: I have always liked early dated coins.
    3. Interesting design: it's got that cool charging knight on one side and a nice eagle on the other.
    4. Size- it's not too tiny: (Hungarian denars of this era also pack a lot of bang for the buck, but this is a little bit bigger.)
    5. Price: all that for a tad under a hundred bucks! And it was already slabbed.

    The same seller had several of these, including an NGC MS61, but based on the pictures, I liked the look of this AU58 example the best.

    That colorful Venetian grosso arrived in the same package, and also looked nice.




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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This one from Brett Smith (aka "BS"). Thanks, Brett! image

    I like how clear the legends are. Normally I can't read the lettering on medievals very well. Plus it's got that great hand coming out of the sky (a "Hand of God?") and that whimsical haloed figure. A saint, I presume?

    Edit- duh- yeah, it's St. Stephen. Has his name right on the coin. image

    And I see they named a cathedral in Metz after him. Interesting.

    I suspect this collection will prove educational, taking me into previously unexplored territory as it has.



    << <i>FRANCE, Metz. Civic issue. 14th-16th century. AR Gros (3.01 gm)
    Boudeau 1659; Saurma 1896/927; Roberts 8932. Toned, good VF >>



    image

    image

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  • ConstantineConstantine Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭
    Very beautiful, thanks for the slideshow.
  • nicholasz219nicholasz219 Posts: 1,386 ✭✭✭
    Lord, that is an interesting and very nice themed collection. I really like the Pius of course because of the tremendous eye appeal and sharp design. I also really like the Parthian coin. I always see those occasionally on the covers of auction catalogs or if I am searching ancients online I might see one here or there. I didn't know what they were and where the kingdom was. Now that I do, I may have to add one of those to my ancient collection just because.

    I also like the Julia Mamaea piece. I have a few denarii of Julia Domna myself and I still like those coins and would like to add to that collection as I learn more about third century denarii.
  • mrpaseomrpaseo Posts: 4,753 ✭✭✭
    Great set, I don't know enough about the series... well, I don't know anything about the series to appreciate more than the eye appeal and the condition for how old they are. Thanks for taking the time to share with us. I do enjoy seeing other collections develop and grow.

    Ray
  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭
    Very nice indeed! I notice you have an Antiochus VIII from Seleucid kingdom... I just picked up this Bactria piece from the Indo-Scythian kingdom (Azes I):

    image
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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Neat Bactrian! It's got a very Eastern sort of look to it.

    I just sent a few other Seleucid and Greek AEs with desert patina off to NGC. One is an Antiochus VIII with the eagle, very much like the one above.

    And it has great patina, too. More of a reddish sandy color than the tan of the coin above, I think. And it was a steal! So cheap I had to buy it.

    The one above cost me around $75-80, raw. The one I just sent off only cost me $20-something, I think, and seems nearly as nice!

    We'll see what NGC says. I'll have to dig up the seller's picture on that.

    (Yes, in this last submission I'm sending a few $15-25 coins off to be put into $35+ slabs. Crazy? Maybe. But I did it... just because.) I figure the extra Seleucid and some of the other cheaper ones can make nice swapstock/BST/eBay fodder later.

    I see I never got around to posting the King John penny or the Justinian I tremissis here (the latter being my first gold for this box!). The tremissis went off in the NGC submission yesterday. King John is waiting, along with my other medievals, to go to off PCGS, once I renew my CC membership. I think I will use PCGS for anything non-ancient, and go for TrueViews.

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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    OK, I have now finished updating this and transforming it into the "master thread" for my Box of 20 collection.

    Now you can see what that flurry of coin posts was all about. I had to post all the "leaves" before I retooled this, the main trunk of the "tree".

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  • AethelredAethelred Posts: 9,288 ✭✭✭
    I like the idea of a collection with a fixed number of coins. If you have 20 and find something to add, something has to go, cool idea!
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  • crypto79crypto79 Posts: 8,623
    That is a cool set, dark side is the wave of the future
  • SYRACUSIANSYRACUSIAN Posts: 6,445 ✭✭✭✭
    IMHO you can still stick to the ADAM initials, since none of the illustrated coins are post 1600. It would be nice to eventually start a second box of 20 for milled coins, in which you can add the ICG graded Aethelred II penny if you're anal about presentation, thus leaving the ADAM box with NGC coins only. image
    Dimitri



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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>IMHO you can still stick to the ADAM initials, since none of the illustrated coins are post 1600. It would be nice to eventually start a second box of 20 for milled coins, in which you can add the ICG graded Aethelred II penny if you're anal about presentation, thus leaving the ADAM box with NGC coins only. image >>

    I considered this, but funds are so tight for me at this stage, it would take me a long time to fill a second box, let alone have anything of quality in it. As it is, many of these coins, while appealing enough to a small-budget guy like me, are not anything to write home about. Now I'd like to bring everything up to where the lesser coins are at least $100-150 pieces, and the better ones $500-1000 pieces. $500 has traditionally been my ceiling, and even then I seldom hit it. Currently only about three pieces here top 500 bucks. I plan on going eclectic for a year or two until the quality has improved a bit. Then I might branch out into separate theme boxes again. I needed funds for the England trip so I there is another reason I have been downsizing.

    But yes, Dimitri, your reasoning is sound. One day the ADAM theme may be revisited. I also have two nephews by that name

    In the immediate future, at least until I self-impose a buying freeze, look for some Liteside and early industrial era additions to begin counterweighing all the ancients. Right now the box is rather Rome-heavy because that is the most recent path I have traveled. In time I hope to mix it up and make this box much more truly eclectic.

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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    First upgrade to the Box of 20.

    Archive of the collection as it appeared on 7/25/13 (Was in loose alphabetical order by country/civilization)

    Archive of the collection as it appeared on 8/7/13, after the changes shown below. (Now in chronological order)


    Two more "modern" additions have bumped out two very old BC-era ancient Greek coins, but the new additions are of much higher quality and value. The box remains, as of this posting, heavily ancient, and will always have some ancient coins in it, but as time goes on, I'll be "mixing it up" a lot more, to give it a truly eclectic flavor.




    First, the two that just went away.


    Ancient Greece: Cilicia, Tarsus, Civic Coinage, bronze AE21, ca. 2nd-1st centuries BC

    image



    Ancient Greece: Mysia, Adramyteum, bronze AE12, ca. 4th century BC

    image




    Next, the pair that replaced them in the Box of 20.


    England, silver sixpence of William III, 1697

    image



    Great Britain, silver "South Sea Company" shilling of George I, 1723

    image



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  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭
    Strictly on eye appeal, I like the two newps more than the ones that went away. But they are completely different areas of collecting so ... if you are happy that's all that matters image

    Personally, I would not have hesitated to replace the Tarsus but I have no idea as to value or historical significance. Just don't like the look of it.
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  • bronzematbronzemat Posts: 2,602 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>
    Personally, I would not have hesitated to replace the Tarsus but I have no idea as to value or historical significance. Just don't like the look of it. >>



    Is it cause of the brown color it has? Stuff like that commonly is called sandy patina. Many ancient collectors like it & there is some who done. Its a preference just like toned vs blast white fans.
  • nicholasz219nicholasz219 Posts: 1,386 ✭✭✭
    I liked the Tarsus but I also like the desert patina. I liked the Zeus portrait more though, and was surprised that LM let it go. Then again, not really surprised. LM trades coins more than I trade underwear.
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I liked the Zeus portrait more though, and was surprised that LM let it go. >>

    I liked it very much. But it is essentially a $16 coin in a $35 slab.

    And now, for the first time, I came up against that aspect of "Box of 20" collecting that many collectors find so daunting. When one comes in, one's got to go out.



    << <i>Then again, not really surprised. LM trades coins more than I trade underwear. >>

    Mea culpa. I am indeed a "high turnover" guy. 'Tis a survival skill I developed twenty years ago when I was really broke. In order to enjoy the "thrill of the chase" and bring in new coins that are even worth considering, I have to sell other coins, and learn to be slightly detached. By being a "flipper", I leave my meager paycheck (mostly) untapped, and it goes towards the household. This keeps the peace, so ladymarcovan does not question my coin purchases. She knows that my coin money comes from coin sales, and most if not all of my regular paycheck goes to her for the bills.

    I buy 'em, hold 'em for a little while, move 'em on, and buy something else. Can't take 'em with me to the next world, anyway. Might as well have my fun with 'em and then let somebody else have their fun with 'em. After all, coins were purposely made to change hands.

    Which isn't to say I don't have my favorites, which I hang onto for years or even decades.

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  • nicholasz219nicholasz219 Posts: 1,386 ✭✭✭
    I have many issues with letting go, lol. As I get better about organizing and keeping records for my collections lately, I see the duplicates at least and figure, well, here is money I could be using for something else. Small steps, LM, small steps. So far LadyZ has not given me any static about purchases. If I were to stop taking her out, that might change very quickly.
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>So far LadyZ has not given me any static about purchases. If I were to stop taking her out, that might change very quickly. >>



    Happy wife, happy life. image

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  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Is it cause of the brown color it has? >>


    I'm cool with sandy patina sometimes. No this was more about the blotchy dispersal of the patina, particularly on the reverse. And it appears to have a slime glaze over it. Just not appealing IMO but I'm sure others adore it.
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  • That Aethelred is my favorite of the bunch. The gold Justinian is pretty cool, too. Overall, a great looking set! image

  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well, I sold several nice pieces back in October of last year to make the England metal detecting trip possible.

    I'll miss those, but the trip was worthwhile, and I dug two hammered silver pennies while I was over there. (One of which, the Edward I, may one day be slabbed and added to this set, just for sentimental reasons. Then again, I may just keep it in my detector finds album.)

    With the last edit, you'll see some new stuff, but some of it has not yet made the round trip to California to be slabbed.

    My goal for the spring of 2014 is to sell off some of the lesser Roman material and round out the collection with some slightly more "modern" stuff (and yes, eventually a US coin or two), to make it more truly "eclectic". Of course I'll be looking to improve the overall quality somewhat and drop some of the "filler" material. (Which are nice enough pieces, but rather mundane for a "Box of 20" type collection.) You can still tell that this box caught the remnants of some past collections and so it's a little Roman-heavy and British-heavy at the moment.

    I'll mix it up a little, as time goes on.

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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you. That Aethelred penny may soon be in a PCGS holder rather than ICG, and it will be TrueViewed, as it deserves better pictures. It has some great toning on it, and was obviously a hoard coin at one time.

    Just added the first US-related piece to the box. I figured it was about time. But I still had to walk off the beaten path a bit and go with a token.

    image

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  • STLNATSSTLNATS Posts: 1,597 ✭✭✭
    Great Monitor token - my absolute fav CWT - in outstanding condition too! Congrats.

    image
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  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭
    I agree, outstanding condition. The features and strike strength seem like it would be hard to find in MS. image
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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Added the 1806 gilt halfpenny now, since "the check's in the mail" for it.

    image

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  • OldEastsideOldEastside Posts: 4,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thats pretty neet Robimage

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  • YorkshiremanYorkshireman Posts: 4,493 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Lord M,
    I really love how you are putting together an eclectic set like this.
    I am doing something similar.
    At the moment, my box includes some British half crowns, some toned Carson City Morgan dollars, some 19th century US gold and some civil war dated silver. I love them all!

    Why decide?
    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • SeattleSlammerSeattleSlammer Posts: 9,953 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Such a cool, cool group of coins.
    image
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It's kind of strange, parting with a BC-era Greek coin for a 19th century US coin (at least for me).

    But that's what just happened.

    Goodbye to Philip II- he's destined for eBay.

    image


    Not that I ever disliked that coin. It's just a bit low grade and has no appreciable patina, is all. I got it as part of a trade involving a couple of raw semi-key circulated Walking Liberty halves, so perhaps it is apt that its place is being taken by anoter United States coin.

    The Alexander the Great drachm above was part of that same trade and is now probably second from the "bottom" in this "Box of 20". After all, when one comes in, one must go out. The Alexander drachm and the Julia Mamaea denarius will likely go away by the end of this month, when two more US coins join the box.

    But before you hiss at me for that, O Faithful World & Ancient Coin Brethren, let me say this... just wait until you see the next two US coins that are coming, that's all. One will be my biggest numismatic purchase in 38 years of collecting. More expensive twice over than the previous biggest purchase, and more expensive than all but two of the vehicles I have ever owned. (Though I usually drive old clunker cars, so that doesn't say much. Right now I drive a 20-year-old Nissan pickup truck.)

    Anyway, here is the latest addition: the three-cent piece I mentioned.

    image

    Kind of close in date to the last addition (the Civil War "Monitor" token), but so what.

    Two more US additions after this, and the US total in the box will be four pieces comprising 20% of the total. Not a bad ratio, considering my loyalties are about 80% world coin and 20% US coin.

    Then it we shall likely travel back to ancient Greece again, if I get the coin I have in my sights (though I may have to sell the somewhat expensive Caligula bronze above to do it).




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  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Unfortunately the 1863 NGC MS63 BN "Monitor" token above was stolen from the dealer's inventory at a show, so I never got it.

    Bummer. However, I did get a refund, and with that money, and thanks to Broadstruck's sharp eye, I was able to grab another off eBay.

    With the Best Offer feature, this second one (an NGC MS65 BN) actually cost me $61.35 less than the first one, and it grades two points higher, so I'm pleased.

    image

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  • YorkshiremanYorkshireman Posts: 4,493 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think that was a good swap, but I am not a fan of ancients.
    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    OK, some "big guns" (Liteside coins) have been added, and the U.S. Dahlonega half-eagle becomes (and is likely to remain for some time) the "top" coin in the box.

    Tops in terms of monetary value, anyway. As I said in the introduction above, my sentimental favorites tend to fluctuate.

    In fact, I just paid for another ancient addition which you can see in my present avatar picture. It will be the next addition to the box and is already high on my sentimental favorites list, though it's not even in hand yet.

    The gilt halfpenny arrived today, as did the Monitor token, and both look nice in hand. ("Nice?" That's an understatement when talking about the gilt halfpenny.)

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  • Steve27Steve27 Posts: 13,267 ✭✭✭


    << <i>OK, some "big guns" (Liteside coins) have been added, and the U.S. Dahlonega half-eagle becomes (and is likely to remain for some time) the "top" coin in the box.

    Tops in terms of monetary value, anyway. As I said in the introduction above, my sentimental favorites tend to fluctuate.

    In fact, I just paid for another ancient addition which you can see in my present avatar picture. It will be the next addition to the box and is already high on my sentimental favorites list, though it's not even in hand yet.

    The gilt halfpenny arrived today, as did the Monitor token, and both look nice in hand. ("Nice?" That's an understatement when talking about the gilt halfpenny.) >>




    As I was looking through all the coins and the swaps, I was thinking how nice your avatar coin looked, and too bad it's not part of the set. Now that I see it will become part of the set, all I can say is NICE COINS!

    "It's far easier to fight for principles, than to live up to them." Adlai Stevenson
  • StorkStork Posts: 5,205 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I really like this thread! I don't think I could ever have it down to '20', but as I go through my coins I am finding I am able to trim things better. I had, at one point, used the OFEC method, but lost interest...in the end I have a few favorite themes or countries (Japan) but for the 'otherwise uncategorized' ones I am TRYING to get THAT to a box of 20.

    I love your collection and it's fun to watch the additions/deletions (and maybe get some ideas...).


    Cathy

  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It gets harder and harder to keep it down to twenty pieces as the coins get nicer, for sure.

    I don't know how long I'll be able to stick with just one box. But my budget constrains me, of course.

    Speaking of budgetary strain, I stretched a bit to pick up this little beauty:

    image

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  • jayPemjayPem Posts: 4,018 ✭✭✭✭✭
    That is a really awesome coin Lord M. ! Is it a pop out ?image
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,194 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It does rather look like some of those Barber dime popout coins, now that you mention it...

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  • mkman123mkman123 Posts: 6,849 ✭✭✭✭
    LordM, really enjoy your writeups. Are your going to writeup on what will replace the 3 cent silver your selling and the decision in doing so? Be interesting to know image
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