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What do you do when you find a nice coin in an NGC holder?

stevepkstevepk Posts: 238 ✭✭✭
I started a thread a couple of weeks back titled 'PCGS, NGC, ANACS: Does it really matter'. It quickly evolved into an NGC bashing. This leads me to question what the rest of you do when you find a nice coin in an NGC holder. I personally have many coins graded by NGC which I take pride in and feel are solid for the grade. Suppose you are browsing a coin show looking for a specific examples to add to your collection. You find several examples on the bourse floor and now are faced with a decision. Suppose the nicest coin just happens to be in NGC plastic. Believe it or not, it sometimes happens. What do you do?

1. avoid buying any coin certified by NGC and limit yourself to PCGS plastic only
2. Buy the NGC coin and enjoy having it in your collection regardless of the plastic
3. Buy the NGC coin and cross it over to PCGS soon after
4. Buy the NGC coin with intentions to cross it over to PCGS before you sell it, which could be several years from now
5. Give no recognition to NGC under the disbelief that any nice coin could possibly be in an NGC holder

I go with option number two. How about you?
«1

Comments

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,301 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Definitely number 2.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • OldEastsideOldEastside Posts: 4,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    2

    Steve
    Promote the Hobby
  • MGLICKERMGLICKER Posts: 7,995 ✭✭✭
    I buy coins. Holders, while a value added feature, should never be an obstacle.
  • BroweBrowe Posts: 236 ✭✭✭
    I think a number of those options are relevant choices. It really depends on your intents and purposes after buying the coin. If I'm strictly looking for a particular piece for my set it does not matter to me where the coin resides, so I'm probably option 2 or 3 depending on the registry started.

    If I'm looking to resell the piece, then I'm going to put the coin wherever the market is going to give me the highest return. Could be crossed, could be sell as is. For this I have participated in options 2, 3, and 4. All have yielded positive results.

    I don't think it's good to limit yourself in this hobby.
  • CoinZipCoinZip Posts: 3,253 ✭✭✭
    I do not discriminate against plastic.

    Coin Club Benefit auctions ..... View the Lots

  • BoosibriBoosibri Posts: 11,841 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Buy it, cross it, CAC it
  • mozinmozin Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭
    For Bust Series coins, #1. Same for Indian Quarter Eagles and Half Eagles. This works well for me, because it greatly restricts what I buy. Not as much chance that I will grossly overspend my coin budget. I have PCGS Regtistry sets in these series.

    For Classic Commemoratives, #1, except I will buy NGC PL Classic Commemoratives, since PCGS does not list PL for this series.
    I collect Capped Bust series by variety in PCGS AU/MS grades.
  • TommyTypeTommyType Posts: 4,586 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm a #2. The coin comes first, price second....the holder, CAC status, seller, etc., are all afterthoughts.

    Easily distracted Type Collector
  • vibr0nicvibr0nic Posts: 614 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Holders should never be an obstacle. >>



    Well said.
    I like large size currency and silver dollars.
  • TahoeDaleTahoeDale Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭
    You could ask the same question re the absence of a sticker, and most knowledgeable collectors( who know their series, and can grade reasonably well)
    will buy the very nice coin in the other TPG holder, if the price is right.

    Latest example- I see a very scarce FH half in NGC 63. Present PCGS guides for this variety is 135,000 in 63 , and 90,000 in 62.
    There have been no auction sales, and no private trades known. The coin has a very small chance to cross at grade, and we can assume it has been tried.
    If the dealer will sell the coin at or near 62 money, I will buy it.

    Even a PCGS graded coin needs to be evaluated re the price you will pay-under guides/market for low enders, and as much as the next grade for the premium ones.
    Recently, an 1808 CBH sold for over 65 guides, in a PC 64 holder. Not an upgrade, as it had been tried several times. But a very colorful coin.

    Many of the Newman coins sold for over PC guides, and all were graded by a TPG company other than PCGS. And many crossed at grade. The buyers of these coins
    knew their expertise would accomplish the result, hopefully.

    Another day to discuss why non-stickered coins are still great buys.
    TahoeDale
  • AMRCAMRC Posts: 4,266 ✭✭✭✭✭
    1-4 as appropriate.
    MLAeBayNumismatics: "The greatest hobby in the world!"
  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,430 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #2 all the way.
    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • #2 coin not plastic thats what matters for my actual collection.
  • BustCudsBustCuds Posts: 1,096 ✭✭✭

    Put me in the #2 camp...buying the coin not the holder.
  • RYKRYK Posts: 35,772 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • crypto79crypto79 Posts: 8,623


    << <i>Cross it ASAP, if not sooner! >>



    Sad but true, number 3 except for one which a charming 1921 Morgan in 61PL in a soap bar, No reason to cross that one. All the rest I have taken multiple grade down grades to get them in PCGS plastic.
  • YorkshiremanYorkshireman Posts: 4,493 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Option 2.
    I actually like the look of NGC holders any way.
    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • DIMEMANDIMEMAN Posts: 22,403 ✭✭✭✭✭
    >>><< Cross it ASAP, if not sooner! >><

    +1
  • brg5658brg5658 Posts: 2,384 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Cross it ASAP, if not sooner! >>



    Sad but true, number 3 except for one which a charming 1921 Morgan in 61PL in a soap bar, No reason to cross that one. All the rest I have taken multiple grade down grades to get them in PCGS plastic. >>




    It is a sad and true reality you have created for yourself, no one else to blame...

    Anyone who picks #1 is simply lunatic in my opinion.

    Aren't #1 and #5 the same thing?

    To each his/her own, but I think this thread is more telling of the psychological well-being of those replying than the "right or wrong" answer.


    -Brandon
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
    My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

  • TommyTypeTommyType Posts: 4,586 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Option 2.
    I actually like the look of NGC holders any way. >>



    An interesting point.

    I'm sure this has probably been discussed to death....but, I know I MUCH prefer the NGC holder. It's just more mechanically and asthetically pleasing in the hand. More substantial, with fewer little tabs and bumps to annoy me, get caught on things, and break off.
    Easily distracted Type Collector
  • DennisHDennisH Posts: 13,963 ✭✭✭✭✭
    3 or 4
    When in doubt, don't.
  • CoinJunkieCoinJunkie Posts: 8,772 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #3.

    I generally hate the aesthetics of NGC holders. The only type of coin I prefer in them is a monster rainbow Morgan,
    which looks good against white.
  • TommyTypeTommyType Posts: 4,586 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Aren't #1 and #5 the same thing?
    >>



    Not quite.

    #1 says "I don't buy NGC coins even if they are nice."
    #2 says, "I don't believe NGC even HAS nice coins."
    Easily distracted Type Collector
  • brg5658brg5658 Posts: 2,384 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>#3.

    I generally hate the aesthetics of NGC holders. The only type of coin I prefer in them is a monster rainbow Morgan,
    which looks good against white. >>




    Do you similarly drink Coke instead of Pepsi because you like the color red can more than blue?? image

    I myself have always thought that what was inside of the package was far more important. lol
    -Brandon
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
    My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

  • brg5658brg5658 Posts: 2,384 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Aren't #1 and #5 the same thing?
    >>



    Not quite.

    #1 says "I don't buy NGC coins even if they are nice."
    #2 says, "I don't believe NGC even HAS nice coins." >>



    If the end result is the same, they are functionally the same -- one would never buy an NGC graded coin.
    -Brandon
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
    My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

  • CoinJunkieCoinJunkie Posts: 8,772 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>#3.

    I generally hate the aesthetics of NGC holders. The only type of coin I prefer in them is a monster rainbow Morgan,
    which looks good against white. >>




    Do you similarly drink Coke instead of Pepsi because you like the color red can more than blue?? image

    I myself have always thought that what was inside of the package was far more important. lol >>


    I don't consume soft drinks. In case you haven't heard, they aren't particularly healthy.

    What's inside the package IS most important, but viewing coins is the ultimate experience of them,
    and if a large, distracting piece of white plastic detracts from that, then it's worth the price to me to
    eliminate it, especially in light of the added value of PCGS plastic which usually more than pays for
    the crossover.

    YMMV.
  • ElcontadorElcontador Posts: 7,412 ✭✭✭✭✭
    PM sent
    "Vou invadir o Nordeste,
    "Seu cabra da peste,
    "Sou Mangueira......."
  • dbcoindbcoin Posts: 2,200 ✭✭
    The other thread did not devolve in NGC bashing. It devolved into possibly ANACS bashing.

    If the intent is to some day sell and make as much as possible, then #3.
  • originalisbestoriginalisbest Posts: 5,911 ✭✭✭✭
    Yes, depending on if I wish to sell it, and depending on the coin, #3. Otherwise #2. Is there also an option for cracking out regardless of holder and placing into a Capital Plastics type set? Cause I've done/am doing that, too.
  • DIMEMANDIMEMAN Posts: 22,403 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I agree with brg5658 that to never buy ngc is crazy. Actually to limit yourself to any slab or raw or whatever is silly. In my quest to find all dimes and all varieties I will go to any site and buy any coin in any slab or not slabbed as long as I like the coin and I am willing to pay the price and need the coin for my set. I then get the non PCGS coins into PCGS so I can get them in my set.

    But that's just me.image
  • GRANDAMGRANDAM Posts: 8,353 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #3,,,,,,,

    I own a Grand Total of 5 NGC Coins and they all went to PCGS for the Quarterly Cross-over Special.

    No results yet image

    GrandAm image
    GrandAm :)
  • coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 10,715 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Clearly I'm option #2 because I'm a coin collector not a slave to a brand of plastic.
    My Lincoln Registry
    My Collection of Old Holders

    Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
  • mdwoodsmdwoods Posts: 5,526 ✭✭✭
    I would go with #3 if I wanted it for a Registry set or was going to resell it. Number 2 if I was going to hold it for a long time.
    National Register Of Big Trees

    We'll use our hands and hearts and if we must we'll use our heads.
  • gypsyleagypsylea Posts: 193 ✭✭


    << <i>Yes, depending on if I wish to sell it, and depending on the coin, #3. Otherwise #2. Is there also an option for cracking out regardless of holder and placing into a Capital Plastics type set? Cause I've done/am doing that, too. >>



    Good man!!!
    Back in the late 80's- early 90's, that is exactly what I did when I got my Walker short set where I wanted it.
    Collector since adolescent days in the early 1960's. Mostly inactive now, but I enjoy coin periodicals and books and coin shows as health permits.
  • halfhunterhalfhunter Posts: 2,770 ✭✭✭
    Buy the NGC coin and enjoy having it in your collection regardless of the plastic . . .

    Doesn't matter . . . One cracks as well as the other,image

    although SEGS holders are hell to crack ! ! ! image

    EDIT - Just scrolled down to find this:

    Is there also an option for cracking out regardless of holder and placing into a Capital Plastics type set? Cause I've done/am doing that, too.

    Should be . . . I just think a set / collection of coins looks & shows much better in a Capital, or some such holder rather having to lay out a bunch of slabs.
    I guess the difference is if one is a collector or an investor . . .

    Heck . . . even a bunch of SHQs look pretty damn good in CP:

    image

    image

    HH
    Need the following OBW rolls to complete my 46-64 Roosevelt roll set:
    1947-P & D; 1948-D; 1949-P & S; 1950-D & S; and 1952-S.
    Any help locating any of these OBW rolls would be gratefully appreciated!
  • 410a410a Posts: 1,325
    What do you do? You buy the coin. I buy them in Anacs holders. I have sold MS 65 Saints in ICG holders at major shows for over Spot. common dates of course. ..........gee Mike........I guess #2image
  • DoubleEagle59DoubleEagle59 Posts: 8,175 ✭✭✭✭✭
    A collector opts for the second choice.

    A coin flipper probably picks #3.
    "Gold is money, and nothing else" (JP Morgan, 1912)

    "“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)

    "I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭


    << <i>... What do you do? >>



    First this:

    2. Buy the NGC coin and enjoy having it in your collection regardless of the plastic

    and then, when PCGS has a crossover special (like they do now), this:

    3. ... cross it over to PCGS ...

    I would've said #4 except I don't sell coins from my personal collection with rare exception. For commerce/business, I wouldn't bother crossing or I may just do #1; look for an equal or better example in PCGS plastic.
    ANA LM • WBCC 429

    Amat Colligendo Focum

    Top 10FOR SALE

    image
  • 410a410a Posts: 1,325
    I would think buying a coin in the NGC holder with the NGC heritage and philosophy would be like getting a nice coin with a free, although not visable, bean. Don't cha think? I'd bet you that a nice coin with old B&W Anacs papers would carry a premium, be even more if it had upgraded to color photos along with it.
  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭
    This should've been a poll. Darn.
    ANA LM • WBCC 429

    Amat Colligendo Focum

    Top 10FOR SALE

    image
  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,430 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Option 2.
    I actually like the look of NGC holders any way. >>



    An interesting point.

    I'm sure this has probably been discussed to death....but, I know I MUCH prefer the NGC holder. It's just more mechanically and asthetically pleasing in the hand. More substantial, with fewer little tabs and bumps to annoy me, get caught on things, and break off. >>



    If you are talking about the new NGC holders with the prongs and improved quality plastic, I agree with you. As for the some of the older ones ... not so much. I had a couple of pieces re-holdered, and after it was done, they looked much better.
    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • orevilleoreville Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Buy it, sticker it, keep it. These pertain to REALLY OLD NGC slabbed coins.

    OR

    Buy it, sticker it. Flip it if it does not sticker. If it stickers, then cross it to PCGS unless not an expensive coin.



    A Collectors Universe poster since 1997!
  • SoCalBigMarkSoCalBigMark Posts: 2,786 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I would buy and flip it to someone who doesn't drink the kool-aid. image
  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,956 ✭✭✭✭✭
    When I see a "+" on the holder of an NGC graded coin that will get my attention.It seems they don't hand out +'s like candy.The NGC + designation causes me to take a second look at the coin.I have a few very nice looking uncirculated coins in NGC + holders and that's where they will stay.

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

  • rkfishrkfish Posts: 2,617 ✭✭✭
    #2
    Steve

    Check out my PQ selection of Morgan & Peace Dollars, and more at:
    WWW.PQDOLLARS.COM or WWW.GILBERTCOINS.COM
  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,303 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The higher grades and less generic the coins get the much harder to cross. If you hadn't tried this route don't assume it "just happens" because you like the coin.

    I've never had a stickered NGC gem type coin cross to PCGS. If you want that to happen be prepared to crack it out. I'm sure the Newman and even Gardner coins could be exceptions to those rules.
    Don't think that your coins get the same "pass" that a major name collection will.

    By all means buy nice NGC coins. Get them stickered too if you can. But don't expect them to cross unless they are widgets. The older holder NGC coins (no line fatties, etc.) can be crossable if blast white.
    Where you run into problems are the gem toned coins of that era that muted the luster a shade. PCGS doesn't usually like that look unless the coins are "toners" with way above average eye appeal.

    What would I do today if I found a nice gem type coin in an NGC holder? I'd buy it if the typical discount was offered. If no discount...I wouldn't buy it since I can go out and pay the same money for an equivalent PCGS coin.
    If I can buy it at a discount, I'd then crack it out and send it back to PCGS (a safer option is to get it stickered first). If it stickers, then crack and send knowing your risk is somewhat less.
    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • TookybanditTookybandit Posts: 3,410 ✭✭✭✭
    #4 ...but in 30 years when I want to sell who knows what the market will be or what grading company will be the market leader?

  • Cougar1978Cougar1978 Posts: 7,544 ✭✭✭✭✭
    2 - I buy the NGC coin and put it in inventory / online store and price it accordingly based on where it falls in the Grade Range usually per market retail - CW Trends, L&C Coins, etc. An NGC 64 WLH I had in my online store went for CW Trends plus about $5 shipping. The coin was PQ, brilliant, wellstruck, with super luster and very nice for the grade.

    In pricing my inventory who's holder its in means nothing to me. What matters is my opinion of it. I price the coin and where it falls in the grade range. As far as crossing it to PCGS I will if I think it may upgrade but never to have it downgraded. I play the crossover game to win.

    In terms of putting together a set, I simply put the coins in an NGC Storage Box which can take all 4 TPG's. The key is to fill the holes then I may upgrade. Could care less about registry except use inventory manager for price updates, I use my excel sheet for viewing and pricing any sets.


    So Cali Area - Coins & Currency
  • originalisbestoriginalisbest Posts: 5,911 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Buy the NGC coin and enjoy having it in your collection regardless of the plastic . . .

    Doesn't matter . . . One cracks as well as the other,image

    although SEGS holders are hell to crack ! ! ! image

    EDIT - Just scrolled down to find this:

    Is there also an option for cracking out regardless of holder and placing into a Capital Plastics type set? Cause I've done/am doing that, too.

    Should be . . . I just think a set / collection of coins looks & shows much better in a Capital, or some such holder rather having to lay out a bunch of slabs.
    I guess the difference is if one is a collector or an investor . . .

    Heck . . . even a bunch of SHQs look pretty damn good in CP:

    image

    image

    HH >>



    For sure, this is the kind of thing I still enjoy doing. There's really no need to lose sleep over it either, as what I'm doing it with, are essentially widgets. I personally prefer my slabs, if I keep the coins in slabs, to be PCGS, as I like them better aesthetically. The fact that the market values them a bit higher, depending on the coin, grade and series, doesn't hurt either. I have certainly bought NGC coins when I liked the coins, particularly if the price matched up with what I valued the coin at, and especially since these were ones I was going to crack out anyway for Capital Plastic holdering. Overall I don't disagree with roadrunner's take at all. When I have had some of my coins graded, PCGS was my choice. That doesn't make me a kool-aid drinker, it makes me a collector of coins who prefers PCGS. Nothing to get all hissy about, both services offer similar services for close to the same $, so you choose the one you like. image
  • tradedollarnuttradedollarnut Posts: 20,146 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Where's the option for 'buy it, downgrade cross it to the correct grade, get it stickered and keep it'? image

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