Should major collection sales have their own tokens?

Zoins · June 22, 2014 11:35AM

Given how big the Pogue sale is and how big other sales have been, should major sales have their own commemorative tokens?

Here's one for the Dan Holmes sale when large cents first broke 7 figures. Also, does anyone know who made this and how many were made?

tychojoe · August 10, 2014 7:42PM

Surprised this thread hasn't gotten any traction!

Zoins, what a fun idea! Excellent for educational purposes and especially YN's. Have you brought your inquiry to others' attention?

The one you posted is way cool.

EastonCollection · August 10, 2014 7:51PM

very cool - never saw this before. I like this idea.

Broadstruck · August 10, 2014 8:34PM

I've seen these Dan Holmes sale tokens cross eBay struck in copper, but don't recall ever having seen another silvered version?

These look like a Patrick Mint creation which are offered in a quantity of 1000 pieces.

Zoins · August 11, 2014 3:08PM

I'm not sure if this piece is silvered or silver but it was sold as the latter and looks much better in hand than in the photos.

I agree these would be great for YNs and as a general way to help people learn about important collections / sales.

I think it would be great if the Pogue sale and others had tokens like these minted

edix2001 · August 11, 2014 6:31PM

I've got that one, too. Copper plate. The reason I like it is because the reverse mimics the actual coin, rather than the standard lines of type on the Patrick Mint pieces.

Also, Patrick Mint catalog pdf file link.

JohnHarper · August 11, 2014 6:41PM

Superior issued similar tokens from the Patrick Mint for five sales during 2002-2004. Going back a generation, Abner Kreisberg issued a token to commemorate sale of the Herbert Bergen collection in 1979. I think such tokens may go back to the nineteenth century but I can't recall a specific example.

keets · August 11, 2014 10:23PM

I suppose things of this nature would be OK as long as they aren't referred to as SC$'s, that would just make a big problem even bigger.

2ndCharter · August 11, 2014 11:27PM

Think of the marketing possibilities - the grading companies could slab them with first sold stickers, Kevin Lipton could hire more homeless people to attend the auction to get the tokens, etc. Now, wouldn't that make for a more entertaining auction?

Coinosaurus · August 12, 2014 3:07AM

These tokens are pretty much worthless, everyone gets the ones passed out at shows and throws them into a box at home.

I do know one person with a collection of about 8,000 tokens related to collectors and dealers. That stash might be worth something.

But other than that these aren't collectible unless you get the exotic stuff like gold ones and overstruck examples.

Broadstruck · August 12, 2014 3:24AM

<< Think of the marketing possibilities - the grading companies could slab them with first sold stickers, Kevin Lipton could hire more homeless people to attend the auction to get the tokens, etc. Now, wouldn't that make for a more entertaining auction? >>

shorecoll · August 12, 2014 3:48AM

2nd...you beat me too it...I was going to suggest they be plated in genuine 24 kt gold, you know .000000001 inches thick.

LindeDad · August 12, 2014 3:54AM

I've got a couple of tokens from dealer's selling on eBay can I get in to the game?

Zoins · August 12, 2014 12:50PM

Sometimes it's nice to make and collect things just for fun, without thinking about the money.

Rewarding in its own way but not always easy to do... or post about apparently

edix2001 · August 12, 2014 1:04PM

Indeed they are fun, much cooler than the bicentennial-era Patrick Mint dealer tokens that were smaller and limited in design. These newer ones cover much of American numismatics and are thus quite educational.

Coinosaurus · August 12, 2014 1:07PM

<< Sometimes it's nice to make and collect things just for fun, without thinking about the money. >>

I hear you. Most of the ones I have were given to me directly by whoever made them, so there is a connection besides just the object itself. I'll probably make one myself someday.

WinLoseWin · August 30, 2014 11:29AM

<< Given how big the Pogue sale is and how big other sales have been, should major sales have their own commemorative tokens?

Here's one for the Dan Holmes sale when large cents first broke 7 figures. Also, does anyone know who made this and how many were made?

>>

Not sure who made the Dan Holmes sale tokens, but here is a link to one of the 10 gold ones issued that was offered in that 2009 sale. It also mentions that 200 were made in silver and 300 in copper.

http://images.goldbergauctions.com/php/lot_auc.php?site=1&sale=54&lot=17&lang=1

JohnHarper · August 30, 2014 11:36AM

The Dan Holmes tokens were struck by the Patrick Mint and issued by Ira and Larry Goldberg for McCawley / Grellman.

WildIdea · August 30, 2014 12:40PM

It's cool as long as they don't look like a silver eagle. Someone might get confused.

Zoins · August 30, 2014 4:27PM

<< Not sure who made the Dan Holmes sale tokens, but here is a link to one of the 10 gold ones issued that was offered in that 2009 sale. It also mentions that 200 were made in silver and 300 in copper.

http://images.goldbergauctions.com/php/lot_auc.php?site=1&sale=54&lot=17&lang=1 >>

<< The Dan Holmes tokens were struck by the Patrick Mint and issued by Ira and Larry Goldberg for McCawley / Grellman. >>

Great info WLW and John!

Here's the text from the Goldberg auction. I'll have to keep an eye out for these.

<< Lot 17

1793 NC-5 Wreath Cent Token in Gold. A copy of the Dan Holmes Collection 1793 NC-5 token. This toekn is modeled on the 1793 NC-5 Wreath Cent owned by the American Numismatic Society, but given bailment to Dan Holmes to present a complete collection of Early Date Large Cent varieties for public view.

This token is one of only tem made in 22kt gold. 200 were made in silver and 300 in pure copper.

All proceeds from the sale of this lot will be presented to ANS along with our appreciation.
Estimated Value $1,000-UP.

Unsold >>

Zoins · March 4, 2019 11:05PM

Old Thread Update

@JohnHarper said:
Superior issued similar tokens from the Patrick Mint for five sales during 2002-2004. Going back a generation, Abner Kreisberg issued a token to commemorate sale of the Herbert Bergen collection in 1979. I think such tokens may go back to the nineteenth century but I can't recall a specific example.

I finally got to see this token. I've seen a different medal with the same obverse as well which I think I may even have.

This Herbert M. Bergen / Abner Kreisberg token was just sold for $96 ($80 hammer) by Stack's.

https://auctions.stacksbowers.com/lots/view/3-GQAUP

Zoins · March 4, 2019 11:10PM

@Coinosaurus said:
These tokens are pretty much worthless, everyone gets the ones passed out at shows and throws them into a box at home.

I do know one person with a collection of about 8,000 tokens related to collectors and dealers. That stash might be worth something.

But other than that these aren't collectible unless you get the exotic stuff like gold ones and overstruck examples.

I wonder if more will start coming out of the woodwork with the above which seems like a common brass variety.

This silver Dan Holmes piece sold for over $130 in 2017 but it is the more rare silver variety with 200 or 25 issued according to 2 different sources.

Here are the gold images from the Goldberg auction where this went unsold posted above.

http://images.goldbergauctions.com/php/lot_auc.php?site=1&sale=54&lot=17&lang=1

Zoins · March 4, 2019 11:27PM

@JohnHarper said:
The Dan Holmes tokens were struck by the Patrick Mint and issued by Ira and Larry Goldberg for McCawley / Grellman.

I'm not sure these were struck by the Patrick Mint as I couldn't find it in their catalog, though they seem to list a lot of dealer tokens they've struck, including for @EagleEye, @FredWeinberg, Kevin Lipton, Don Kagin, and others.

Here's one sale they do list for C. Douglas Smith:

Patrick Mint Catalog: http://www.patrickmint.com/website.pdf

Broadstruck · March 5, 2019 3:19AM

I guess based on my username this obverse design might work?

Twobitcollector · March 5, 2019 4:06AM

Zoins · March 5, 2019 4:34AM

I just noticed this looks like an error token too because it says "Commerating" instead of "Commemorating"! I wonder if they are all spelled like this or if there are 2 varieties.

291fifth · March 5, 2019 7:26AM

Medals such as this (I think of "tokens" as having a stated face value) are very interesting collectibles. Unfortunately, they fall into the post-1960 medal era when few items have much of a collector following. Forget about "value" just collect them because they are a part of numismatic history.

lava · March 5, 2019 9:16AM

Maybe in a couple hundred of years the tokens in the junk box might be highly sought after, as it's been known to happen.

Zoins · April 13, 2019 3:14PM

@Zoins said:

@JohnHarper said:
Superior issued similar tokens from the Patrick Mint for five sales during 2002-2004. Going back a generation, Abner Kreisberg issued a token to commemorate sale of the Herbert Bergen collection in 1979. I think such tokens may go back to the nineteenth century but I can't recall a specific example.

I finally got to see this token. I've seen a different medal with the same obverse as well which I think I may even have.

This Herbert M. Bergen / Abner Kreisberg token was just sold for $96 ($80 hammer) by Stack's.

https://auctions.stacksbowers.com/lots/view/3-GQAUP

Old Thread Update

It looks like this was made by the Lombardo Mint which is still around:

http://www.lombardomint.com/

Here's a history of the Mint:

About our company

Orazio Lombardo, the founder of Lombardo Mint, was born in Milan, Italy in 1926. In 1952, he set up his company called Lombardo Speciality Reg'd in the basement of his home and specialized in enamelled products, lapel pins as well as fine jewellery. In 1955 he then moved his company to a two-storey building and renamed it Canadian Artistic Dies; thereby reflecting the expansion of the firm's product line to the engraving and cutting of dies for other mints, as well as the minting of medals and souvenir dollars. The name 'Canadian Artistic Dies' appears on most of the medals struck by the firm during this period of its history. The firm began to enjoy a reputation for high quality and artistic craftsmanship especially for its three dimensional medals. Later in 1960, the company was renamed Lombardo Mint Inc. and specialized in the minting of medals, badges, tokens, souvenir and trade dollars.

Today, Lombardo Mint Inc. is proud to be a division of Mississauga Mint!

Mississauga Mint specializes in producing high quality numismatic products which include tokens, trade dollars, metals & medallions, for various uses and events, both commemorative and corporate. Mississauga Mint has stamping, tumbling, rimming and coining capabilities, as well as specialized packing in its 10,000 square foot facility. Quality is assured by a dedicated 3300 square feet of Clean Room Assembly space. Mississauga Mint owns the most, high speed, coining equipment of any private mint in Canada.

Associated with Mississauga Mint are…..

Greg Ingram, a noted life long collector of coins, tokens and medals. He is a published authority on Canadian and English numismatic products.

Larry Coburn has engraved and designed, well over 2000 dies of various sizes. These dies have minted foreign legal tender, medallions and commemorative world figures as Mohammad Ali. Working with renowned artist, Marc Chagall, one of his most prestigious programs to date has been the 12 Chagall window replicas.

Projects quickly become a reality with our full in-house capability and control.

Here's a Lombardo Mint medal I just ran across with the same obverse:

.999 Silver: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1973-200-Years-of-Liberty-USA-Silver-Round-999-Made-in-Canada-Lombardo-Mint/183517730210

This says "LOMBARDO" on the reverse under the left bell. It is edge stamped "999" and "MADE IN CANADA".

ricko · April 14, 2019 5:25AM

Interesting idea... It would be nice to have a token from a sale of great collector interest/value to go with the purchase. No great benefit to have a token without an accompanying purchase. Might even be interesting to have them double slabbed. Cheers, RickO

mrearlygold · April 14, 2019 6:39PM

I'm sure he must be gone by now but the fellow who cut the dies from my Florida silvers was a company in Chicago ( chicken on the car the car can't go that's the way to spell Chicago.....something like that ) named Alpha Die Engraving, the person Hermke Timm and he was known for really precision die engraving. My cost then was about $1200 for obverse and reverse dies. Check mm's of common gold and you may be able to strike some in gold or silver albeit at different weights for the size and keep a couple for special friends, family etc.

Zoins · April 14, 2019 11:27PM

@mrearlygold said:
I'm sure he must be gone by now but the fellow who cut the dies from my Florida silvers was a company in Chicago ( chicken on the car the car can't go that's the way to spell Chicago.....something like that ) named Alpha Die Engraving, the person Hermke Timm and he was known for really precision die engraving. My cost then was about $1200 for obverse and reverse dies. Check mm's of common gold and you may be able to strike some in gold or silver albeit at different weights for the size and keep a couple for special friends, family etc.

Great info Tim. Do you have any photos of your Florida silvers? I would love to see them.

Zoins · January 16, 2020 12:54AM

Just ran across this one from Thomas Elder for the Peter Mougey, Esq. sale.

Anyone have one of Peter's coins?

cardinal · January 16, 2020 7:21AM

@Zoins said:

@Coinosaurus said:
These tokens are pretty much worthless, everyone gets the ones passed out at shows and throws them into a box at home.

I do know one person with a collection of about 8,000 tokens related to collectors and dealers. That stash might be worth something.

But other than that these aren't collectible unless you get the exotic stuff like gold ones and overstruck examples.

I wonder if more will start coming out of the woodwork with the above which seems like a common brass variety.

This silver Dan Holmes piece sold for over $130 in 2017 but it is the more rare silver variety with 200 or 25 issued according to 2 different sources.

Here are the gold images from the Goldberg auction where this went unsold posted above.

http://images.goldbergauctions.com/php/lot_auc.php?site=1&sale=54&lot=17&lang=1

I attended that auction and there were only 25 made of the silver medals, whereas there were a large number of the copper medals.

Should major collection sales have their own tokens?

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