Incredible Barber 50c clash -- real or fake?
errormaven
Posts: 1,168 ✭✭✭
This 1912 Barber half dollar shows the strongest possible die clash.
Link
There is complete transfer of the design on each die face to the field and low-lying portions of the opposite die. There are even clash marks of the denticles.
Has anyone seen a Barber clash similar to this? From the photos, I see no indication that this planchet was struck by heavily clashed counterfeit dies. Still, the rather heavy wear leaves me a bit uncertain.
There is a 2000-P nickel with a clash as strong as this, so it's not physically impossible.
-- Mike Diamond
Link
There is complete transfer of the design on each die face to the field and low-lying portions of the opposite die. There are even clash marks of the denticles.
Has anyone seen a Barber clash similar to this? From the photos, I see no indication that this planchet was struck by heavily clashed counterfeit dies. Still, the rather heavy wear leaves me a bit uncertain.
There is a 2000-P nickel with a clash as strong as this, so it's not physically impossible.
-- Mike Diamond
Mike Diamond is an error coin writer and researcher. Views expressed here do not necessarily reflect those held by any organization I am a member of.
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Comments
Edit: just kidding, that's really weird. The incused part goes under the devices
bob
-Paul
<< <i>Looks legit to me.
-Paul >>
It'd be quite a steal if it turns out to be real.
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
That's the largest die clash Half I have seen.
Post the image to the Mega Barber Thread.
Some Barberites might miss it in its own thread.
Great pick up.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
<< <i>That's the largest die clash Half I have seen.
Post the image to the Mega Barber Thread.
Some Barberites might miss it in its own thread.
Great pick up. >>
It wasn't my pickup, unfortunately. A good friend of mine got it.
I did a search for "Mega Barber" but came up with nothing.
Rare because the dies must have been retired as soon as the press operator could get the press stopped. Imagine the "CLANG!" this must have made when they hit! Also, the impact seems to have caused a cud, or possibly a retained cud, below "(G)OD W(E)." Notice the raised area that does not correspond with anything above "HALF" on the reverse, and how the end of the clashmark of the tip of the branch disappears into this void.
Way Kewl!
TD
I'll be writing this specimen up for Coin World, along with a remarkable clash on a 1917 half dollar.
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
2000-P 5c clash
All eight or so examples I've seen from this die pair feature a weak center with an unusually rough surface. Evidently, all these planchets were abnormally hard with a coarse surface texture. Perhaps the press operator cranked up the ram pressure to compensate for the excessively hard planchet and when the dies clashed, it was with tremedous force.
Standing Liberty Quarters !!!!!
If it had been correctly listed, it would have fetched multiples
of $46.00. I wonder who the seller is from Waltham, Massachusetts ?
I know a couple of dealers who'd have offered him a substantial offer
over what he ended up selling it for.
The more I look at it, the more I'd like it for myself. It would be a
great exhibit piece for the course Glenn Holsonbake & I are teaching in
Colorado Springs at the 2nd Session at the ANA - entitled: THE COINAGE
OF CHARLES BARBER.
OP: you can find the Barber Mega Thread on the US Forums at PCGS - type
In the search box BARBER - don't bother with Mega... It should jump out at you.
Tell your friend "congratulations" and he deserves a YOU SUCK AWARD
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
I am very interested in acquiring an example of the 2000 nickel die clash. Please PM if you know of any examples that are for sale.
Both of the die clash errors in this thread are extremely nice examples.
-Paul
<< <i>Here's a link to the only other clash I've seen that's equally strong:
2000-P 5c clash
All eight or so examples I've seen from this die pair feature a weak center with an unusually rough surface. Evidently, all these planchets were abnormally hard with a coarse surface texture. Perhaps the press operator cranked up the ram pressure to compensate for the excessively hard planchet and when the dies clashed, it was with tremedous force. >>
Mike, that is also a monster clash!
Did you notice that on both pieces the struck coins look a bit "flat?" I wonder if the powerful clashes were strong enough to change the radius of the convex dies, flattening them out enough for the border lettering & etc. to also clash? Normally the curvature of the dies would keep those areas away from each other.
TD
My War Nickels https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/nickels/jefferson-nickels-specialty-sets/jefferson-nickels-fs-basic-war-set-circulation-strikes-1942-1945/publishedset/94452
<< <i>Interesting that it circulated as long as it seems to have. Extremely neat piece and a great pickup! >>
Just remember that those of who consider something like this to be way kewl are an extremely small (though perceptive and discerning) percentage of the population as a whole!
<< <i>
<< <i>Here's a link to the only other clash I've seen that's equally strong:
2000-P 5c clash
All eight or so examples I've seen from this die pair feature a weak center with an unusually rough surface. Evidently, all these planchets were abnormally hard with a coarse surface texture. Perhaps the press operator cranked up the ram pressure to compensate for the excessively hard planchet and when the dies clashed, it was with tremedous force. >>
Mike, that is also a monster clash!
Did you notice that on both pieces the struck coins look a bit "flat?" I wonder if the powerful clashes were strong enough to change the radius of the convex dies, flattening them out enough for the border lettering & etc. to also clash? Normally the curvature of the dies would keep those areas away from each other.
TD >>
You may be correct, but it's really hard to be certain. Any change in die convexity is likely to be very subtle. The die face is relatively flat (and the design rather low) in nickels of the late 1990's to the present, and that probably facilitated the complete transfer. I don't think it could have happened in even the strongest clash had the nickel been from the early 1980s when die convexity was much stronger.
This was a tremendous clashing. Since the dies were of equal hardness, they may well have pancaked each other.
TD
<< <i>Your conjecture may turn out to be correct. There are any number of explanations for weakness in the center of a coin. What I did notice is that the unusual roughness is also present on the top of the design rim, where effective striking pressure tends to be weak. So something was odd about the planchet. >>
I see what you mean about the rim on the nickel.
Just my idle first thought, not having seen the coin...If the dies did pancake a bit when they slammed into each other down inside the collar, the outer border of the die might have bulged outwards a bit during the clash and impacted against the inside of the collar, causing the rim in the die (which is of course incused) to crumple a bit and become rough.
Would love to see one of the nickels.
TD