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Thread Title: My stuff on PCGS CoinFacts...and a little controversy
Created On Wednesday October 28, 2009 4:39 PM
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homerunhall
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Wednesday October 28, 2009 4:39 PM

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Hello Everyone,

Been a while. Sorry I don't post more, but I've really been spending a lot of time on PCGS CoinFacts. There are a lot of cool coin stories posted by the contributing experts. Here's one I did on the 1896-S Morgan dollar...actually make that the 1896-S Morgan dollar...

The incredible MS69 coin surfaced at a Mid-West coin show in the 1980's. Dealer Chuck Walanka asked me if I wanted to see two special coins and then he proceeded to show me the 1884-S later graded by PCGS MS68 and the 1896-S later graded by PCGS MS69!!!!! Needless to say, I was virtually speechless. I bought the coins for what was a big price at the time...I think I paid him $40,000 for the pair. I sold both coins to collector George Bodway. Later, Jack Lee bought the Bodway collection intact, combining the two best Morgan dollar collections of the time into one. Jack continued to upgrade his set, building the greatest Morgan dollar set of all-time.

The 1896-S is one of the most amazing coins I've handled in my career. When I first saw it I couldn't believe my eyes...it has absolutely flawless, mark-free surfaces. What a coin! I was really glad the late George Bodway got the coin as he was very passionate about his coins and he was a really genuinely nice man. Ditto the late Jack Lee, one of the true gentlemen of the coin community.

Here's a little controversy...do naturally rainbow toned Peace dollars exist...I don't think so. Here's what I said on PCGS CoinFacts...

Note that I am of the very strong opinion that any 1921 Peace dollar...indeed any Peace dollar...that has any rainbow colors (blue, red, green, etc) is absolutely artificially toned. While not very scientific, my approach to toning on coins is to remember the colors I saw in the 1960's and 1970's and if a new look appears, it's artificial to me. This is kind of an "old school" approach and I may be wrong, but unless you believe global warming has created new colors for coins, it just seems illogical to me that new colors would suddenly appear naturally on coins.

So...I never saw a single Rainbow toned Peace dollar in the 1960s or 1970s, but of course I saw thousands of rainbow Morgans. Perhaps the silver was a little different, or handled a little different. You certainly don't see the white spots on Morgans that you see on 1922 and 1923 Peace dollars. Anyway...that's what I think.

I hope you'll like PCGS CoinFacts. It does cost $10 bucks a month, but I know you all can afford that

Check out PCGS CoinFacts. It is incredible information. If you sign up and don't like it...let me know and I'll send you a ten dollar bill for your trouble.

PCGS CoinFacts

HRH

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JupitarCoins
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Wednesday October 28, 2009 4:41 PM

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I think its worth the $10 a month for all that information.


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Ahrensdad
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Wednesday October 28, 2009 4:43 PM

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I started a thread about a week ago asking that you do just, post some of your memories like you did a couple years ago. Thanks for sharing.

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PrivateCoinCollector
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Wednesday October 28, 2009 4:43 PM

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How about a 30 day free trail for Collector's club members? What is the down side?

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    cheezhed
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 4:44 PM

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    It would be nice if the service was included in the platinum membership.

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    blu62vette
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 4:48 PM

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    Thanks for the story. Interesting take on the Peace dollars. For those of us not around in the 60's or 70's it is always good to hear how coins have "changed".



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    WoodenJefferson
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:03 PM

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    Glad to find out I'm not the only one who is not crazy when saying all these "rainbow" coins were out of the norm back in the 60's and 70's, they were considered "tarnished" and just didn't have the appeal they have now days.

    Can't say that I ever remember seeing a Peace Dollar that had a significant amount of color, there were reddish brown ones, but the delineated colors you'd see on Morgans were just not there on the bland Peace buxs.

    Going into the 60's, it's pretty amazing that some casinos were still using silver dollars in their slot machines.

    edit: yes, my keyboard went nutso for a second, never seen that before.



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    Edited: Wednesday October 28, 2009 at 5:49 PM by WoodenJefferson

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    braddick


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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:10 PM

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    Interesting, but in the 1960's, say, Peace dollars were 40 years or so old. Now, 40+ years later, wouldn't it be possible to see naturally toned, colorful Peace dollars?

    I'd think so. In the mid 1920's the Morgans of the 1880's were 40 years old.

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    leothelyon
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:13 PM

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    The questions that come to mind, how would such coins tone and in what enviorment. Since most Morgans were stored in bags, what about the Peace dollars? And when were any of the dollars ever placed in paper rolls or how popular was it in those days, rolled silver dollars? All which begs the question, how did some coins get their toning? Rolled coins? Coin albums? Cabinet drawers? If there are simple explainations to the toning of some coins, I'd like to hear them. From anyone.


    Leo

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    JupitarCoins
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:26 PM

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    << Glad to find out I’m not the only one who is not crazy when saying all these “rainbow†coins were out of the norm back in the 60’s and 70’s, they were considered “tarnished†and just didn’t have the appeal they have now days.

    Can’t say that I ever remember seeing a Peace Dollar that had a significant amount of color, there were reddish brown ones, but the delineated colors you’d see on Morgans were just not there on the bland Peace buxs.

    Going into the 60’s. it’s pretty amazing that some casinos were still using silver dollars in their slot machines.     >>



    Is their something wrong with your keyboard?

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    RYK
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:41 PM

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    << How about a 30 day free trail for Collector's club members? What is the down side? >>



    HRH: "Check out PCGS CoinFacts. It is incredible information. If you sign up and don't like it...let me know and I'll send you a ten dollar bill for your trouble.

    PCGS CoinFacts

    HRH"

    I think that HRH is essentially offering you exactly that, but in reverse.

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    ColonialCoinUnion
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:45 PM

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    I have 2 conclusions:

    1: PCGS Coinfacts is a cool site.

    2: People really like free stuff.

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    mkman123
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:46 PM

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    Can someone post a pic of the MS68 and MS69 morgans the OP was talking about? I never knew they had them in that high of a grade........

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    thebigeng
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:53 PM

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    Pat excellent point, we must renew our thinking now and again...

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    dbldie55
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:54 PM

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    << Can someone post a pic of the MS68 and MS69 morgans the OP was talking about? I never knew they had them in that high of a grade........ >>



    If you signed up for CoinFacts you would (or you could just sign up for a month of the Population Reports for $4.95)

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    WoodenJefferson
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 5:57 PM

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    << Interesting, but in the 1960's, say, Peace dollars were 40 years or so old. Now, 40+ years later, wouldn't it be possible to see naturally toned, colorful Peace dollars?

    I'd think so. In the mid 1920's the Morgans of the 1880's were 40 years old.     >>



    How many colorfully toned Morgans from 1921 do you see?

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    blu62vette
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 6:03 PM

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    <<

    << Interesting, but in the 1960's, say, Peace dollars were 40 years or so old. Now, 40+ years later, wouldn't it be possible to see naturally toned, colorful Peace dollars?

    I'd think so. In the mid 1920's the Morgans of the 1880's were 40 years old.     >>



    How many colorfully toned Morgans from 1921 do you see?     >>



    Aren't the 21 morgans the same planchet as the peace?

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    MANOFCOINS
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 6:37 PM

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    Nice history lesson there HRH.

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    BECOKA
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 6:51 PM

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    <<

    <<

    << Interesting, but in the 1960's, say, Peace dollars were 40 years or so old. Now, 40+ years later, wouldn't it be possible to see naturally toned, colorful Peace dollars?

    I'd think so. In the mid 1920's the Morgans of the 1880's were 40 years old.     >>



    How many colorfully toned Morgans from 1921 do you see?     >>



    Aren't the 21 morgans the same planchet as the peace?     >>



    Well, then how many colorfully toned 1921 Morgan's have you seen? I for one have not seen any which might mean the same mixture was used in the transition to Peace dollars.

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    Connecticoin
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    Wednesday October 28, 2009 7:08 PM

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    << Interesting, but in the 1960's, say, Peace dollars were 40 years or so old. Now, 40+ years later, wouldn't it be possible to see naturally toned, colorful Peace dollars?

    I'd think so. In the mid 1920's the Morgans of the 1880's were 40 years old.     >>



    Agreed. If HRH was looking mostly through mint bags, then there likely were not very many toned Peace Dollars. However, there were probably album toned ones in existence in the 70s, but not near as many as now, as the Peace Dollars place in Wayte Raymond and later Whitman albums in the 1940s through 1970s probably did not tone colorfully until the 1980s and 1990s.

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